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 Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
 Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 4:47 am 
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Hmm...

On CC side the blast seems to have been contained by the airlock, so we probably don't have to worry about CC casualties in the Portal room and subsequent payments.

I don't think the tripods will be an issue anymore either.
For one thing I don't thinik they're still functional (or at least still pointed at the portal) after THAT explosion, but even if they are, Parson would be stupid to keep any of his casters (or himself, since he's carrying Maggie) standing in front of the portal after THAT - there's baiting for contract breaches and there's insanity...

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 6:26 am 
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    I'm going with my original theory that this is taking out CC's power. The second to last panel could be contrast with the explosion or CC actually is going dark. The lights looking like that could be a surge from the damage, which may do the same thing. Unless the lights where part of the shockamancy trap.

    My bet is that Charlie doesn't know what to do and won't immediately react yet. GK might have a smoke screen in the portal area so Lillith can sneak the weapons out, and GK can get them under cover. But the weapons need a veil also so MK sides with GK rather than CC. More MK neutrality and politics coming soon, but the next update will likely answer more pressing questions about the extent of the damage.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:42 am 
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    Knott wrote:
    Now the big question is if the explosion coming out of the portal is purely coming from the HEAT, or if it is augumented by traps. Hopefully this one will be answered on monday.


    Marie is standing in front on purpose though, as I suspected was a likely possibility after page 107. But I was expecting to see a lot more get hurt in the first swoop.

    If the explosion is trap agumented, and causes Charlescomm to breach, then the tripod assault just became that much more likely to happen. An M3-Tripod is mighty big for a Chekov's Gun though...

    Last I checked, there was no explosion coming out of the portal per say, just shrapnel and bits of wall carried through the portal on the momentum of the explosion.

    As for how a single rocket could do so much damage, maybe it was one of those Fuel Air rockets from Mercenaries 2: World In Flames?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:52 am 
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    I believe Lilith survived at least the initial shot of RPG as we see her behind it in distance. At max she was incapacitated. If shs survived the following explosion I hope so. The RPG seemed to upload its operation manual into her head, she should know safe distance and blast area. Secondary explosions are another matter.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:59 am 
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    I don´t see how in the fuckin´frickin Titan´s name THIS kind of damage is not going to trigger the signamancy contract...

    If it, indeed, doesn´t, maybe a little of Retconjuring will be in order...

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:27 am 
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    Lipkin wrote:
    youngstormlord wrote:
    Lipkin wrote:
    Pro: Marie looks to have taken the brunt of the blast, leaving GK's forces unharmed.

    Con: Because only Marie got hurt, GK doesn't earn any punitive shmuckers.


    Not necessarily. If Marie was stacked with GK units, according to the contract it would mean GK gets shmuckers. Thing is, we don't know if this counts as Charlie hurting someone by trap or not.

    Lipkin wrote:
    Pro: To the outside observer, it appears that Charlie just attacked into the Magic Kingdom. That has the potential to hurt him a great deal.

    Con: Maggie still isn't healed, and it seems like Marie could definitely be injured now as well. They only have one scroll, and it belongs to Marie. Could lead to a difficult choice.


    True, but there's no reason GK can't hire a healomancer while in the magic kingdom. They could even walk to hippies and get THEM to hire healomancer.
    Lipkin wrote:
    Chekhov's Archon: With that much force to the blast, we don't know if Lilith survived.


    Also, depending if this blast counts as triggering trap. I hope it does.

    Parson indicated that Marie going through the portal wouldn't cost them anything, so I'm assuming that her getting hit also doesn't trigger anything. There is also a very good reason they couldn't hire a Healomancer. GK is currently broke.

    As far as Lilith goes, it doesn't matter if this counts as triggering a trap or not. If she wasn't far enough away from the blast, the rpg she just fired could have dusted her.



    GK may be broke, but within the MK the casters use Rands. Either Sizemore or Janis would have a few to spare to save a friend, I am sure.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:37 am 
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    In my opinion, the clause about attempting to cause material harm to the units, cities, property, or other assets should have triggered back when she was blowing down doors and stealing stuff, but the contract seems to have its own opinion.

    Maybe it will get clarified, but it does seem odd.

    Perhaps the contract is associating material value to things that cost Shmuckers to replace? Fixing doors and other stuff, and even replacing the weapons might just take juice from casters, so technically they don't cost anything? It's a stretch, but value to us and them might not be the same. When you have as much saved up as Charlie, value is even more relative (or more like irrelevant) too. :P

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:57 am 
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    So, who else thinks Maggie is awake already and is just pretending to be in a coma to remain in Hamster's arms? Notice the brief grip of her hand in the first slide.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:28 am 
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    I have stayed out of the 'material harm' debate so far, but I have a strong suspicion that if we hear nothing of the treasury next strip that 'material harm' will only constitute the actual loss of a unit or property. Damaging will not count as material harm because it is just repaired next turn anyway. Even though some of GK appear to have taken Hits in the explosion, I do not think it will help their treasury because nothing has been materially lost that we see. I have heard theories that Lilith took no hits when the Archons hazed her, but she was cut up. I have to believe that can only happen if hits are taken (not that she matters because GK already did not have her, so nothing that happened to her counts as harm to them).

    In short no one will pay anything because of this unless Charlie lost an Archon. Hits and damage should not be punished because they literally are not material harm in Erfworld until they go down to 0.

    Also, why do people keep assuming that the scroll is only for one person. If that was the case, Marie wouldn't have saved it for later. I think she saved it because it is a Healing Circle, or something similar.

    Lastly, it drives me bonkers how much the phrase "Chekhov's Gun" is overused in this forum. I thought people read to much into things in my Script Analysis classes for theatre, but those students trying for A's have nothing on you guys.

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    Last edited by CarniDollMancer on Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:35 am 
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    Anomynous 167 wrote:
    As for how a single rocket could do so much damage, maybe it was one of those Fuel Air rockets from Mercenaries 2: World In Flames?


    Two things.
    1. Enclosed space.
    2. Secondary Explosions.

    Venatio wrote:
    So, who else thinks Maggie is awake already and is just pretending to be in a coma to remain in Hamster's arms? Notice the brief grip of her hand in the first slide.



    I'm afraid panel 1 makes it look like Maggie has a broken arm. Better to remove the hand and just show her arm dropping underneath Parson's.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:56 am 
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    That "pow" font... I've seen it before.

    As for the Heal Scroll, it could be that Parson gets forced into a choice -- heal one, decrypt the other.

    If Marie is healed and Maggie is decrypted, I'm thinking that's a problem. Marie won't be absolved of the Deal of a Lifetime, and Maggie may have a personality shift again, to something more stand-offish again.

    Of course, if "Love" survives decryption, it could:

    1. Give Parson a conduit into Wanda's mindset via the connection to the Arkenpliers
    2. Clear Maggie of any obligation she has to the GMTTA

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:12 am 
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    Charlie hasn't made a play yet, and its hard to believe he wouldn't have an agent within the Magic Kingdom at this point. So far Lilith has been running roughshod over his plans to the point where Charlie's corollary #1 is going to kick in.

    Its clear that Charlie is attempting to gain a tactical advantage by achieving the next technological tier long before all other sides do. Its probably a large investment in order for total military conquest as a grand strategy. However, that technology is about to make it to GK.

    Once Parson has the technology, he could either keep it secret with Charlie and they could sign an armistice (which I think parson would prefer as he knows the horrors of home), or he could leak it to other sides and form an alliance against Charlie, escalating Erfworld warcraft. However, if I was Charlie I'm not sure he knew Parson well enough to know he'd do that.

    Not unless Charlie himself was from home as well...

    So, odds are Charlie may wish to retain his military advantage by turning the MK against him by violating neutrality. He may just bomb the weapons, pay the treasury, and declare war on MK.

    What would the odds be? Poor...

    But knowing Charlie... I would leverage a neutral party into achieving the same result.

    Beware the Carnymancer...

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:24 am 
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    Guynietoren wrote:
    I'm going with my original theory that this is taking out CC's power. The second to last panel could be contrast with the explosion or CC actually is going dark. The lights looking like that could be a surge from the damage, which may do the same thing. Unless the lights where part of the shockamancy trap.

    Agreed, Guynietoren. The star-shaped items flying through the air on the last line are either generator-type deals arranged around the Portal, or traps that weren't immediately triggered for some reason.
    Question : Are the portals truly indestructible? Even a bit of damage visible to the MK-side Portal should trigger all of these Casters to gang up on GK. Their lives would peter out to nothing, stuck on that island without Schmuckers or a source of Rands, if GK kills Portals.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:50 am 
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    Anomynous 167 wrote:
    As for how a single rocket could do so much damage, maybe it was one of those Fuel Air rockets from Mercenaries 2: World In Flames?

    The SFX indicate that the missile's payload is a High Explosive Anti-Tank warhead, which despite the name, isn't really all that explosive. The H.E.A.T. is an incendiary device designed to penetrate armor by largely containing the explosion of the internal charges and using the extreme temperature and pressure to unleash a torrent of molten metal that tears through the plating and kills the operators of the target vehicle. Of course, the extent of the reaction is dependent on the target so whatever Lilith hit must have been really volatile.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:56 am 
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    nargbop wrote:
    Agreed, Guynietoren. The star-shaped items flying through the air on the last line are either generator-type deals arranged around the Portal, or traps that weren't immediately triggered for some reason.
    Question : Are the portals truly indestructible? Even a bit of damage visible to the MK-side Portal should trigger all of these Casters to gang up on GK. Their lives would peter out to nothing, stuck on that island without Schmuckers or a source of Rands, if GK kills Portals.


    portals are on or off, they don't get visibly damaged.

    the GK portal survived that volcanic eruption.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:05 am 
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    nargbop wrote:
    Guynietoren wrote:
    I'm going with my original theory that this is taking out CC's power. The second to last panel could be contrast with the explosion or CC actually is going dark. The lights looking like that could be a surge from the damage, which may do the same thing. Unless the lights where part of the shockamancy trap.

    Agreed, Guynietoren. The star-shaped items flying through the air on the last line are either generator-type deals arranged around the Portal, or traps that weren't immediately triggered for some reason.

    To me they look like omni(or at least many)-directional turrets that can therefore target anything in the room.

    @El Chupacabra: I believe the Pow font is from Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island.

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    Last edited by CarniDollMancer on Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:10 am 
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    starburst98 wrote:

    portals are on or off, they don't get visibly damaged.

    the GK portal survived that volcanic eruption.


    Did anyone ever discuss how none of the magma or ash came through the portal after they arrived? Prior to this update we could have surmised that only things purposefully carried, passed, thrown, or sent (scout golem) through a portal will get through, but now we have an trap explosion going through, which effectively is what the volcano was.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:18 am 
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    Oh shit, sharpnel, in the ass. Please tell me Marie kept her legs.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:19 am 
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    This seems like pretty solid confirmation that 'damage' to buildings, walls, etc is more window dressing then anything, and doesn't actually matter. (Or that Charlie had planned to knock down some GWK structures during the truce, and worked in a loophole)
    The fact that putting out the inferno in spacerock restored the livery supports that. Why would sizemore had wasted juice on something purely cosmetic in the middle of an inferno, unless it was all just visuals.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 3 - Page 111
     Post Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:26 am 
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    Scroll of Mass Heal or other multiple target healing spell. Hippiemancers and foolamancers and croakamancers can all mass cast. Marie said it wasn't time yet. She knew more units would need healing.

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