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 Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:38 am 
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Merilynne wrote:
They're playing for fingers and toes? Their own? :shock:

Does this mean Juggle Elves have repositionable fingers and toes?

No, I think they just count on them being restored at the start of the next Turn. All wounds healed, after all...

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:40 am 
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    I am loving Maggie's growth as a character. I wonder if thinkamancers all can think without juice, they just subconsciously expend some to think 'harder'. I can't wait to see her replace the great minds, hopefully.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:41 am 
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    It also occurs to me that Maggionette could do a hell of a lot of damage to CC just by ordering the other dolls (which we know she can do) to start attacking TV units but ineffectually at a cost of $1m for every poke to the ribs or kick to the shins. Surely that story Charlie told Wanda must be foreshadowing for something.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:42 am 
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    No one in particular wrote:
    Merilynne wrote:
    They're playing for fingers and toes? Their own? :shock:

    Does this mean Juggle Elves have repositionable fingers and toes?

    No, I think they just count on them being restored at the start of the next Turn. All wounds healed, after all...


    Do severed body parts always vanish at start of turn? Or can you keep them if they're claimed?

    It raises the possibility of doing grotesque things like wearing bone armor made out of your own bones, or skinning yourself over the course of several turns to make a taxidermy replica of yourself as decoration.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:43 am 
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    I had to read it twice, but I figured out what the "third accessory that makes Ace a man" is. :oops: And an "underwear" joke! That is classic (if a bit questionable in the realm of classy).

    Which makes the reference to touching his accessories.... oh my! :oops: :shock: :oops:

    Some first rate naughtymancy going on here. :D

    And an excellent update all round. Solid perspective pieces!

    Edit: Now that I look at it again, Ace is REALLY sexually fixated. "Chief Hugeness", "beefing up", "Chief Volcano"...is this the result of him not being able to "auto-special" his "gun"?


    Last edited by Cantripmancer on Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:48 am, edited 2 times in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:45 am 
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    Love the juxtaposition of their voices in the text.

    After several pages of huge developments we come to a page setting up some more. Good. What's Parson's move here aside from waiting for Wanda & Co. to show up? Does he grab a miracle pole, stack with Ace, poke his head through the portal, and look around? Bonnie has her hat back on but presumably their gonna get some mags off Sizemore and send them to TV?

    As for Maggie, man... I dunno. Did she just take control of Fashion Maggie or give it some free will or something? It's still in CC livery so she can't have taken her back. And what is the doll doing? Just mouthing off? Is it going to attack a fellow CC unit?

    God damn it now I gotta wait until Friday.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:49 am 
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    Citizen Alan wrote:
    It also occurs to me that Maggionette could do a hell of a lot of damage to CC just by ordering the other dolls (which we know she can do) to start attacking TV units but ineffectually at a cost of $1m for every poke to the ribs or kick to the shins. Surely that story Charlie told Wanda must be foreshadowing for something.

    You can cause violations without even doing damage. Real Maggie could surrender to Fashion Maggie. Fashion Maggie takes real Maggie prisoner, costing CC, before setting real Maggie free. Rinse, repeat, until CC tries to disband the doll.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:54 am 
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    It's nice to see Maggie learning to actually THINK, not just to follow

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:58 am 
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    Man, Fashion Maggie looks as uptight as Book 1 Maggie

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:24 am 
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    I've been reading Erfworld since like page 5 in book 1 when it was posted on GITP back in the day, but I think this is the first time I've ever actually posted. But I had a thought, and was curious to what others might think about it.

    I'm wondering, with his fascination with them as the Ultimate Accessory... could Ace possibly attune to the Arkenpliers? Is it canon that only one unit can be attuned to a 'Tool at a time?

    It would certainly explain why Wanda might end up joining Jillian, in sheer anger and despondency to someone else daring to use what she feels is Fated for her.

    Makes me wonder if the 'Tools might change some aspects of their abilities depending on who is using them. We've only seen one user of the 'Shoes, 'Hammer, and 'Dish. The 'Shoes provided a Warlady with infinite move, the 'Hammer gives Stanley (who is not bright, impulsive, and sees himself as a powerful combatant and ruler) the ability to tame dwagons, rock, shock, and fly. The 'Dish helps Charlie be the Ultimate Carnymancer.

    The 'Pliers in Ansom's hands, while not fully attuned, just gave him a huge bonus against Uncroaked. Ansom's pretty straightforward and unimaginative, the 'Pliers didn't have a lot to work with there. But in Wanda, who is obsessed with bringing units back, it became the ultimate Uncroaker, probably feeding on both her Croakamancy as well as the regret of losing her brother and her original side.

    If my theory is right, Ace attuning would likely allow him to grant that same auto-specialization ability to his guns that he's so focused on right now. And would likely bump up his accessory making.

    Just a thought.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:35 am 
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    Lipkin wrote:
    Citizen Alan wrote:
    I am increasingly certain that Claud (and likely Ivan) will not make it to Jetstone. Ace's absolute certainty that they are both coming renders it impossible under the Rule of the Announced Plan.

    Yeah. Parson probably sends Wanda the Pliers via hat, only for Wanda to take the pliers, Claud and Ivan to Faq, whereupon she turns.

    Why would she turn to Faq? There's nothing for her there. Now conquering ICFYS... that may tempt her. And it would require her to turn barbarian so she could face the Queen...

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:38 am 
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    Whispri wrote:
    Lipkin wrote:
    Citizen Alan wrote:
    I am increasingly certain that Claud (and likely Ivan) will not make it to Jetstone. Ace's absolute certainty that they are both coming renders it impossible under the Rule of the Announced Plan.

    Yeah. Parson probably sends Wanda the Pliers via hat, only for Wanda to take the pliers, Claud and Ivan to Faq, whereupon she turns.

    Why would she turn to Faq? There's nothing for her there. Now conquering ICFYS... that may tempt her. And it would require her to turn barbarian so she could face the Queen...


    Well, it's fated she'll turn to FAQ, so she'll turn. Whether she'll want to turn is another matter entirely.

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    *Decryptocurrency - Wanda and the moneymancer.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:41 am 
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    Rob,
    You've dubbed Parson Chief Volcano. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE have Ace make him some new 'duds' with a frickin' volcano. Give this man a makeover! *starts petition*

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:51 am 
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    Omnimancer wrote:
    Whispri wrote:
    Why would she turn to Faq? There's nothing for her there. Now conquering ICFYS... that may tempt her. And it would require her to turn barbarian so she could face the Queen...


    Well, it's fated she'll turn to FAQ, so she'll turn. Whether she'll want to turn is another matter entirely.


    I have to quibble with you there. Unless I've missed something, the only reason to think Wanda might turn to FAQ is Marie saying "I'll tell [Wanda] it is fated." Given Marie's recent streak of dubious trustworthiness, that could just be her promising to lie to and manipulate Wanda, who has been shown to heed Marie's advice before.

    --Again, that's if I haven't missed anything else in the interim.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:54 am 
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    Whispri wrote:
    Why would she turn to Faq? There's nothing for her there. Now conquering ICFYS... that may tempt her. And it would require her to turn barbarian so she could face the Queen...

    Because World War Tool would make an awesome book 5.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:00 am 
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    Wow.... so much to take in... It seems very much like Maggie is growing to be the first of the new 'great minds'... I see a huge parallel in discipline perception in this update to Jack's perspective updates. In Jack's perspective, he sees the world how it is, how it could be and (most importantly I think for masterclass status) how others see it. Now Maggie is walking a similar path, being forced to recognize how non-thinkamancers 'think' without juice...

    Oh well.... back to the mines...

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:05 am 
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    RandomNPC wrote:
    I have to quibble with you there. Unless I've missed something, the only reason to think Wanda might turn to FAQ is Marie saying "I'll tell [Wanda] it is fated." Given Marie's recent streak of dubious trustworthiness, that could just be her promising to lie to and manipulate Wanda, who has been shown to heed Marie's advice before.


    Indeed, the only element you are missing is one that makes you MORE correct. I am not the only unit fated to serve Queen Jillian.

    That's HIGHLY suspicious wording. She doesn't even say "caster" or "FAQ!" Maybe she just has vague details that COULD apply to Wanda. Maybe Jillian will kill Stanley, attune to the pliers, and rule over Wanda as Queen of Gobwin Knob. Marie might think turning Wanda to turn to FAQ is the "easy path," and she might even be correct, but so what? Delphie had the same logic for making Wanda turn to Haffaton, and look how THAT attempted simple solution turned out in the end. :shock:

    Edit: technojunkie, that is an excellent point. Jack is still unmistakably a Master Foolamancer when he has no juice. Perhaps it is the mark of a true master that their discipline transcends magic itself.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:10 am 
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    Merilynne wrote:
    They're playing for fingers and toes? Their own? :shock:

    Does this mean Juggle Elves have repositionable fingers and toes?

    Juggle Elves are based on Juggalos, fans of the Insane Clown Posse. Among the characteristics attributed to Juggalos is a rebellious disregard for their own well-being, including a willingness to scarify themselves for nothing more than shock value.

    On Erf, of course, amputated digits will be restored at the beginning of the next turn, so shock value is pretty much the point.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:10 am 
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    Nice to hear from Ace again. Wow, he's really hung up on the auto-Specialing failure if a former Jetstoner is willing to learn Carnymancy.

    Loved Maggie's section too. It makes a lot of intuitive sense that a Master of a particular discipline would need to stop seeing that discipline as some marvelous, unknowable thing on a pedestal to be able to understand it on that level.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 167
     Post Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:10 am 
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    RandomNPC wrote:
    Omnimancer wrote:
    Whispri wrote:
    Why would she turn to Faq? There's nothing for her there. Now conquering ICFYS... that may tempt her. And it would require her to turn barbarian so she could face the Queen...


    Well, it's fated she'll turn to FAQ, so she'll turn. Whether she'll want to turn is another matter entirely.


    I have to quibble with you there. Unless I've missed something, the only reason to think Wanda might turn to FAQ is Marie saying "I'll tell [Wanda] it is fated." Given Marie's recent streak of dubious trustworthiness, that could just be her promising to lie to and manipulate Wanda, who has been shown to heed Marie's advice before.

    --Again, that's if I haven't missed anything else in the interim.

    Maybe that would have worked earlier in this book. Maybe it still will, considering it would be poor to do two fakeouts WRT Wanda turning in a row. But it would be a lot more dramatic if Wanda decided to croak Jillian instead, triggering full contract default in the middle of all these other shenanigans.

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