Forum    Members    Search    FAQ

Board index » Erfworld Things » Reactions




Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 617 posts ] 
 
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
 Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 7:07 pm 
User avatar
Has collected at least one unit
Offline
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 3:20 am
Posts: 71
Crisco wrote:
Were it not for Jojo acting on his behalf (via Carny shenanigans), the action would've halted immediately after the last Archon dropped. At that point, GK could've sorted things with the free casters and that would be that. Charlie would've been censured (or received some other indeterminate punishment commensurate with croaking free casters in the MK), GK and the factions would've probably had some long talks, and life would move on. If, at that point, the MK denizens decided to press for a trial/execution of Wanda anyway, it would still almost certainly be a kangaroo court held out of a combination of fear and a desire to suppress decrypted, but it wouldn't be built on a foundation of Carny lies (although other lies would almost certainly be involved) magically making people forget where bullets came from.


I don't think so because I don't think you realize how much the MK, in general, hates/is afraid of Parson because of what he's done. He's a commander who can go into the MK. He brought an army in there too (via Decryption.) And at the Battle of Portal park, he finally brought war into the MK as well.

For free casters this is pretty scary. The one place on Erf where they could go and not have to deal with the wars and such, where they could chill out and do caster things, was compromised.

As such, Jojo's carnymancy shenanigans were little more than taking advantage of the tensions in the caster population to scapegoat the GK forces. As such even if he hadn't painted a target on the GK forces once the fighting was joined in earnest it wouldn't have stopped until the GK forces were defeated no matter how many Archon corpses had popped up.

It's typical mob mentality. Once everyone's ire is up and action is joined they go with the flow using whatever methods they have until cooler heads prevail and either shut down the mob or direct it's actions in a worthwhile manner. As shown by the shenanigans in the Dirtamansion, that's the weakness of Free Casters: they don't have those cooler heads.

Jojo's pretty good at what he does but he's not a Foolamancer or a Thinkamancer. He didn't hide the bullets from the casters nor did he make them forget about them, he just convinced them that those bullets were GK's fault. Which, while a lie, is a very convincing lie based upon the truth that if the GK weren't there, then those bullets wouldn't have been either.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 7:23 pm 
    Has collected at least one unit
    Offline
    Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:06 am
    Posts: 268
    I don't read Wanda as changing her behaviour on anything. She has always been working for one aim, using everything to hand for it, pretending or claiming everything and anything others want or expect from her . . . the whole time holding fast to her "evil" plans.
    When she looks like a perfectly passive leaf being carried along towards the firing squad by events, that is when you have to ask if why she is passive is you are unwittingly carrying her where she was intending to go anyway, like a mere hired chairman. One ought to insist on payment before setting out, with 't Gentry, fond of letting the working man go hang at the divvy up, our betters.

    Charlie was wrong trying to get the payout scheme running. He is down multiple units because he didn't have just one close to close range, shoot, then the others could try to deal at range.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 7:39 pm 
    Has collected at least one unit Here for the 10th Anniversary
    Offline
    Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:55 pm
    Posts: 562
    That's just it: it isn't a convincing lie. Like, at all. Bullets came out of CC's portal, and hit free casters. No further GK units came out of the portal. A convincing lie based on that MIGHT be that they brought full on war, but that's not what he said. He said GK killed free casters, and everyone just kinda went, "yup, that's what happened." Again, without his magic intervention, there might be a trial eventually, but there wouldn't have been a full on melee, nor would there have been any grounds to argue about who was culpable. It was quite obviously aggression by Charlie and his forces, but not a single person was so much as entertaining that possibility during the trial because wow, carnymancy Jedi magic.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 8:05 pm 
    Offline
    Joined: Tue May 23, 2017 7:25 am
    Posts: 38
    Ansan Gotti wrote:
    What?

    Charlie's comeuppance here is a result of him screwing over TGMTTA (as part of a long-running cold war turned hot), and while the way in which DeIsaac was created might have been Fate, we have no proof at all that that was the actual reason.


    There is an exceptional amount of coincidence around Deissac's rebirth. Two casters had to be in a geographically unique location accessible only to them, croaked in a specific way, and out long enough for Charlie to kill the minds. (dictated by the time it takes for Janis to get the pliers to Wanda) The minds had to be in their strongest fusion to cut remote strings, and the gestalt had to be walking by Lilith at just the right time (Janis again) to notice the guns trained on Wanda. That's just too much "right place at the right time" for me to count in anything but direct fate intervention.

    I still like the twist. Yes, it's bugging me that :charlie: Charlescomm :charlie: can't get a win, but as long as the story shows a fate exploit/gives a hint fate can be beaten before handing the reigns back to parson it's a good setup.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 8:18 pm 
    User avatar
    Has collected at least one unit
    Offline
    Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 3:20 am
    Posts: 71
    Crisco wrote:
    Again, without his magic intervention, there might be a trial eventually, but there wouldn't have been a full on melee, nor would there have been any grounds to argue about who was culpable. It was quite obviously aggression by Charlie and his forces, but not a single person was so much as entertaining that possibility during the trial because wow, carnymancy Jedi magic.


    If it was so obvious, no one would have been fooled. While it's incredibly obvious to us, the readers, to the casters who were just milling about until some of them got croaked things are much less obvious. After all, GK forces have guns and are standing around Charlie's portal.

    GK has guns, bullets are flying, free casters are croaking. The only casters who have more information (and will actually be listened to) than this are the GMTTA and any Lookamancers who happened to be looking at the time. The first group have their own agenda and the latter group aren't going to go against the mob mentality when it's already stacked so hard against the GK, especially since they probably don't like them as much as the rest of the MK at that point.

    Even then, none of them can prove that it was Charlie being aggressive towards Free Casters. The only people who can prove that are the Archons who fired the shots and Charlie himself and of course they're going to say that he was only aggressive towards the GK forces. Especially since it's the truth.

    So again, Jojo scapegoated the GK forces and the only reason it's been so effective is because he (and Charlie with the trial) are taking advantage of the tensions and stress put upon the MK by the GK forces.

    It's way easier to convince people that someone's done something they don't like if they already don't like them.

    Which is something of an undercurrent theme going on with this book, from Parson's 'Grand Strategy' meeting to how he's handling TV vs. Charlie's established practices and how insane his resource and tech lead is.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 8:20 pm 
    Print Book 2 & Draw Book 3 Supporter This user is a Tool! Pin-up Calendar and New Art Team Supporter Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit Erfworld Bicycle® Playing Cards supporter Was an active Tool on Free Cards Day Won Mine4erf for the Marbits Spades Suit Pip Arkenhammer Supporter
    Offline
    Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2014 2:28 pm
    Posts: 24
    Crisco wrote:
    That's just it: it isn't a convincing lie. Like, at all. Bullets came out of CC's portal, and hit free casters. No further GK units came out of the portal.


    When in a firefight you cannot really tell where the bullets are coming from. The witnesses never got a freeze-frame shot of the bullets leaving the portal. A break-down of what the casters experienced:

    Getting hit by unknown damage causing pain
    Hearing pop-pop (bullets are faster than sound) from the direction of
    GK troops with strange weapons by CC's portal

    Then a fight between GK troops (with strange weapons that go pop-pop) and floating arrows.
    Dead archons
    Decrypted archons.

    For a group that already LIKES Charlie (he pays!) and hates GK (they invaded our sacred space!) the concept that, what you now understand to be bullets, came through the portal (impossible!), is easy to disregard. GK will say anything to implicate Charlie and take blame off themselves. GK threatened the citizens of the Magic Kingdom the first day the troops arrived: "interfere and you will die and be resurrected as one of us"! The mobs cursing out the troops had gotten bigger every time they had come to the portal.

    Jojo could only carny the casters he touched. We see him touch 2, maybe 3, casters. The rest was using carny sense to the say the right things at the right time to the right people to get them to act as they already wanted to act and believe the things that they already wanted to believe. Mobs have been whipped into similar frenzies throughout time and place across stupid world with magic or magical senses.

    - ninja'd darnit

  • Tipped by 2 people!
  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 8:24 pm 
    Offline
    Joined: Sat May 20, 2017 7:18 pm
    Posts: 73
    MrYar wrote:
    I don't think so because I don't think you realize how much the MK, in general, hates/is afraid of Parson because of what he's done. He's a commander who can go into the MK. He brought an army in there too (via Decryption.) And at the Battle of Portal park, he finally brought war into the MK as well.


    See, that's just it. Parson brought army into MK, trough Decryption. Sure, that army might have been bit rude towards casters in their zeal to protect GK commanders, but nothing more. To have a war, one needs two sides, and it was Charlie that brought second army into MK, and not trough decryption, but trough his portal, just like that. Killing/banning Wanda from entering MK solves entirely Decrypted army issue. Not keeping lots of corpses in MK also prevents her from suddenly rushing MK. But none of those do anything about Charlie being able to dump an army into MK. Oh, right, they are going to block his portal. I'm sure he will not fund dummy side to serve as his front in contacts with MK, including desant point from another rigged portal if he ever decides it's time to take over MK.

    To be fair, probably biggest reason trial went the way it did is because Great Minds did not tell everyone how dangerous Charlie really is, because it would require admitting to what they can do, how they were breaking old Bargain. Or maybe GMs, despite their knowledge about underground bunker (that's where they found Claud and Ivan) still underestimated Charlie and figured Parson can still defeat him, no matter how they work against him. At least this quickly came back to bite their asses.

  • Tipped by 1 person!
  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 9:06 pm 
    Offline
    Joined: Tue May 23, 2017 7:25 am
    Posts: 38
    qq wrote:
    MrYar wrote:
    I don't think so because I don't think you realize how much the MK, in general, hates/is afraid of Parson because of what he's done. He's a commander who can go into the MK. He brought an army in there too (via Decryption.) And at the Battle of Portal park, he finally brought war into the MK as well.


    See, that's just it. Parson brought army into MK, trough Decryption. Sure, that army might have been bit rude towards casters in their zeal to protect GK commanders, but nothing more. To have a war, one needs two sides, and it was Charlie that brought second army into MK, and not trough decryption, but trough his portal, just like that. Killing/banning Wanda from entering MK solves entirely Decrypted army issue. Not keeping lots of corpses in MK also prevents her from suddenly rushing MK. But none of those do anything about Charlie being able to dump an army into MK. Oh, right, they are going to block his portal. I'm sure he will not fund dummy side to serve as his front in contacts with MK, including desant point from another rigged portal if he ever decides it's time to take over MK.

    To be fair, probably biggest reason trial went the way it did is because Great Minds did not tell everyone how dangerous Charlie really is, because it would require admitting to what they can do, how they were breaking old Bargain. Or maybe GMs, despite their knowledge about underground bunker (that's where they found Claud and Ivan) still underestimated Charlie and figured Parson can still defeat him, no matter how they work against him. At least this quickly came back to bite their asses.


    Except that, to the people watching the trial, Charlie only brought his army into the MK as a reaction to Parson attacking his portal. Parson's just hanging out because he wants to. He could have disbanded the units there, or made them barbarian, or come up with some kind of compromise to make the casters feel more comfortable. He sets up shop with the elites, starts scouting Charlie's portal straight-off, and then just sits there. With his death army.

    I'd be joining with Charlie too.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 9:32 pm 
    Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
    Offline
    Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 8:30 pm
    Posts: 447
    PastorofMuppets wrote:
    words


    If I've not said this before, Pastor Of Muppets is my name on several other forums.... I half thought I'd had posted something and forgotten I had posted, almost panicked and checked with the Doctor for Alzheimers symptoms.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 10:31 pm 
    Has collected at least one unit Here for the 10th Anniversary
    Offline
    Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:55 pm
    Posts: 562
    yogomakeoshimi wrote:
    Crisco wrote:
    That's just it: it isn't a convincing lie. Like, at all. Bullets came out of CC's portal, and hit free casters. No further GK units came out of the portal.


    When in a firefight you cannot really tell where the bullets are coming from. The witnesses never got a freeze-frame shot of the bullets leaving the portal. A break-down of what the casters experienced:

    Getting hit by unknown damage causing pain
    Hearing pop-pop (bullets are faster than sound) from the direction of
    GK troops with strange weapons by CC's portal

    Then a fight between GK troops (with strange weapons that go pop-pop) and floating arrows.
    Dead archons
    Decrypted archons.

    For a group that already LIKES Charlie (he pays!) and hates GK (they invaded our sacred space!) the concept that, what you now understand to be bullets, came through the portal (impossible!), is easy to disregard. GK will say anything to implicate Charlie and take blame off themselves. GK threatened the citizens of the Magic Kingdom the first day the troops arrived: "interfere and you will die and be resurrected as one of us"! The mobs cursing out the troops had gotten bigger every time they had come to the portal.

    Jojo could only carny the casters he touched. We see him touch 2, maybe 3, casters. The rest was using carny sense to the say the right things at the right time to the right people to get them to act as they already wanted to act and believe the things that they already wanted to believe. Mobs have been whipped into similar frenzies throughout time and place across stupid world with magic or magical senses.

    - ninja'd darnit

    1. You ever been in a firefight? It's pretty clear where bullets are coming from; there's a report (bang) coming from a pretty clear direction, unless you're in as area rife with mountains where it'll echo. Hell, we literally have technology capable of pinpointing exactly where someone is based on gunfire sounds.

    2. As far as we've seen, sound doesn't carry through portals. There wouldn't have been anything other than a possible sound of impact on the MK side of the portal, in this case. Even when the debris came through, there was no explosion sound, just debris. Gunfire wouldn't have started yet. That should've been evidence enough that something was off, even before Archons (non caster units, which should've been disbanded on contact) came pouring through the portal.

    3. You said it yourself, GK/Parson made it clear: don't mess with them and you're fine. They've been there plenty of time without incident, until all of a sudden shit starts flying out of the CC portal. Again, evidence something is off.

    4. Yes, it is obvious CC started it (in reference to the post before yours, I'm on my phone and don't want to mess with multiple quotes here), but as I said, apparently carnymancy is super Jedi magic instead of the incredibly limited power we've been told. This has been shown over and over. It's a broken school. Every new power shown is more ridiculous than the last. It's not even a surprise that JoJo rewrites the narrative on a whim when it happens because lol carnymancy.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 11:01 pm 
    Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
    Offline
    Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:57 am
    Posts: 846
    Crisco wrote:
    yogomakeoshimi wrote:
    Crisco wrote:
    That's just it: it isn't a convincing lie. Like, at all. Bullets came out of CC's portal, and hit free casters. No further GK units came out of the portal.


    When in a firefight you cannot really tell where the bullets are coming from. The witnesses never got a freeze-frame shot of the bullets leaving the portal. A break-down of what the casters experienced:

    Getting hit by unknown damage causing pain
    Hearing pop-pop (bullets are faster than sound) from the direction of
    GK troops with strange weapons by CC's portal

    Then a fight between GK troops (with strange weapons that go pop-pop) and floating arrows.
    Dead archons
    Decrypted archons.

    For a group that already LIKES Charlie (he pays!) and hates GK (they invaded our sacred space!) the concept that, what you now understand to be bullets, came through the portal (impossible!), is easy to disregard. GK will say anything to implicate Charlie and take blame off themselves. GK threatened the citizens of the Magic Kingdom the first day the troops arrived: "interfere and you will die and be resurrected as one of us"! The mobs cursing out the troops had gotten bigger every time they had come to the portal.

    Jojo could only carny the casters he touched. We see him touch 2, maybe 3, casters. The rest was using carny sense to the say the right things at the right time to the right people to get them to act as they already wanted to act and believe the things that they already wanted to believe. Mobs have been whipped into similar frenzies throughout time and place across stupid world with magic or magical senses.

    - ninja'd darnit

    1. You ever been in a firefight? It's pretty clear where bullets are coming from; there's a report (bang) coming from a pretty clear direction, unless you're in as area rife with mountains where it'll echo. Hell, we literally have technology capable of pinpointing exactly where someone is based on gunfire sounds.

    2. As far as we've seen, sound doesn't carry through portals. There wouldn't have been anything other than a possible sound of impact on the MK side of the portal, in this case. Even when the debris came through, there was no explosion sound, just debris. Gunfire wouldn't have started yet. That should've been evidence enough that something was off, even before Archons (non caster units, which should've been disbanded on contact) came pouring through the portal.

    3. You said it yourself, GK/Parson made it clear: don't mess with them and you're fine. They've been there plenty of time without incident, until all of a sudden shit starts flying out of the CC portal. Again, evidence something is off.

    4. Yes, it is obvious CC started it (in reference to the post before yours, I'm on my phone and don't want to mess with multiple quotes here), but as I said, apparently carnymancy is super Jedi magic instead of the incredibly limited power we've been told. This has been shown over and over. It's a broken school. Every new power shown is more ridiculous than the last. It's not even a surprise that JoJo rewrites the narrative on a whim when it happens because lol carnymancy.

    Casters did not trust Wanda, she might decrypt them all in one massive battle. GK had a standing army in Magic Kingdom for first time ever.

    Nature of people in stupid world is to shape the facts to fit their desired beliefs. Eg Obama is bad and Bush is good or reverse in US politics. We mostly hear only the bad side of warming in coldest regions of earth as result of "climate change". In our part of world, Russia is bad in eastern ukraine, but Saudi arabia no big deal bombing in Yemen and Egypt referendum not so bad despite you get arrested for advertising for other side. US has a law against funding any country that acquires nukes and yet funds Israel, India, Pakistan.

    The casters wanted Wanda and friends gone, they were a threat. Yes the casters also wanted Charlie gone. The details don't matter too much, only whatever yields desired end result, seen similar games in real life when emotional people argue.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 11:08 pm 
    User avatar
    Offline
    Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2017 5:20 pm
    Posts: 1171
    Going back to the subject of the Carnymancer's influencing the trial itself, we know as a matter of fact that they've been systematically stirring things up against GK since at least the battle for Spacerock and probably did so on Charlie's behest to get Parson kicked out of the MK the first time. We also know from the observations of the GMTTA during RVC's updates that the Carnies were working to influence the outcome of the trial, both through open advocacy and Carnymancy.

    Of course the corresponding point that the GMTTA hasn't been completely honest and above board in all their dealings is worth noting, particularly in light of this most recent update. Deisaac seems to know way more about Lilith (both the battle of Lilith and the nature of her connection to Wanda) than the GMTTA were willing to reveal during the trial. Indeed, he wasn't dancing around in front of Lilith by some kind of accident, he veiled while heading for her after apparently clearing Parson to his own satisfaction. He could have been planning to help Wanda escape initially, though he might well have gathered that she was already free by the time we see him on the move. But it was certainly an intentional move resulting from some Decision.

    The Predictamancers are also apparently engaged in some complex B.S. game, what with P. Roffercy's 'defection' to lead nearly everyone away from the prisoners so that Deisaac has no serious obstacles other than a couple of bored Stuffamancers (Derrick is definitely snoozing, the new guy doesn't look especially awake, given the excitement I'm suspecting a suggestion of some kind). Annie basically calls their B.S. games by wondering how much of it is really necessary and how much is just for their own amusement. And who even knows what other factions are acting to influence events to some other end.

    Thinking about it can make anyone tired, I'm not surprised a lot of people would rather think of fairly straightforward tactical innovations rather than wade blindfolded through the treacherous undercurrents of MK politics, but we can't really avoid them at this point in the story.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 11:53 pm 
    This user is a Tool! Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit Mined 4 Erf Won Mine4erf for the Gobwins Was an active Tool on Free Cards Day Clubs Suit Pip Diamonds Suit Pip Hearts Suit Pip
    Offline
    Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2010 4:20 pm
    Posts: 1015
    Melendwyr wrote:
    About Charlie "holding the idiot ball":

    Remember, his Signamancy is based on Charlie Brown. And Charlie Brown never gets to the football. He can't resist attempting to kick it, even though he's pretty sure it's going to be yanked away at the last moment. It's who he is.

    Charlie can't resist taking a kick at Wanda, even though in a sense he knows better.

    It would be cool if for Book 4, Wanda had Lucy van Pelt Signamancy...


    And, yes, I know the joke has been made before.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 3:27 am 
    Has collected at least one unit
    Offline
    Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:06 am
    Posts: 268
    Crisco wrote:
    1. You ever been in a firefight?
    No. However, often been out on the first day of the duck season. Can't say I could have been sure exactly where on my left or right, shots were coming from.
    We need the opinion of someone who has been shot at.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 4:16 am 
    User avatar
    Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit Was an active Tool on Free Cards Day This user is a Tool!
    Offline
    Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:35 am
    Posts: 2594
    Location: Wales... New South Wales
    Tonot wrote:
    Crisco wrote:
    1. You ever been in a firefight?
    No. However, often been out on the first day of the duck season. Can't say I could have been sure exactly where on my left or right, shots were coming from.
    We need the opinion of someone who has been shot at.

    Would it matter in the Magic Kingdom' court of law? None of the surviving witnesses during the trial were shot at.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 6:40 am 
    Here for the 10th Anniversary
    Offline
    Joined: Sun May 19, 2013 5:55 pm
    Posts: 1503
    Crisco wrote:
    Apparently carnymancy is super Jedi magic instead of the incredibly limited power we've been told. This has been shown over and over. It's a broken school. Every new power shown is more ridiculous than the last.
    I love that about Carnymancy. It's a mysterious magic of trickery and Carnymancers like to lie about what Carnymancy can do, because they can make more money by tricking their clients. I'd bet that Carnymancy can't really do most of the things that we've seen Carnymancy apparently doing, because Carnymancers are tricking people into thinking that it's more powerful than it is.

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
     Post subject: Re: Book 4 - Page 119
     Post Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:49 pm 
    Has collected at least one unit
    Offline
    Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 3:07 pm
    Posts: 39
    Good grief!

  • Tip this post

    Make Anonymous
  • Top 
       
    Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
     
    Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 617 posts ] 

    Board index » Erfworld Things » Reactions


    Who is online

    Users browsing this forum: Despiser, DiabloAzul, Night Train and 4 guests

     
     

     
    You cannot post new topics in this forum
    You cannot reply to topics in this forum
    You cannot edit your posts in this forum
    You cannot delete your posts in this forum
    You cannot post attachments in this forum

    Search for:
    Jump to: