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 Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
 Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 5:34 am 
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Swodaems wrote:
mroozee wrote:
The sound effect to the falling beam kind of says it all... MANOS the Hands of Fate.

That movie is legendary as being one of the worst movies of all time. It is known for bad acting, worse effects, and bad editing. There are implications of pedophilia. It was made as a bet by a producer who didn't know what he was getting into. It would have remained a rather obscure work if a better known show, MST3K, hadn't helped it along,


Don't forget that when the serious character actor that played Torgo saw the movie, he killed himself.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 5:54 am 
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    Oreo2483 wrote:
    oooh look Maggie is crying for parson!

    The signamancy has been showing for a while, but I smell some parson x Maggie shipping in the near future!



    I think that Maggie loves Parson, but not that she is in love with him. We don't know her background, but given the way she presents herself to the world, I bet that his leadership and presence have made her feel secure for the first time in a long time, maybe ever.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 6:04 am 
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    coyotenose wrote:
    Oreo2483 wrote:
    oooh look Maggie is crying for parson!

    The signamancy has been showing for a while, but I smell some parson x Maggie shipping in the near future!



    I think that Maggie loves Parson, but not that she is in love with him. We don't know her background, but given the way she presents herself to the world, I bet that his leadership and presence have made her feel secure for the first time in a long time, maybe ever.

    I like this angle far more than the maggie/parson ship.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 6:49 am 
    Print Book 2 & Draw Book 3 Supporter This user is a Tool! Year of the Dwagon Supporter This user was a Tool before it was cool Shiny Red Star Pin-up Calendar and New Art Team Supporter IRC Quote of the Moment This user got funny with a rodent Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
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    Is there some significance to the "Pray the Titans" line? My first thought was that it was meant to be "Pray to the Titans", but I have been known to miss some of the references in the comic from time to time (the MANOS one being a good example). Is this a reference to something else, or just a strange wording?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:51 am 
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    joosy wrote:
    in carny speak, a Clem is a fight between townies and carnies.

    ...and the Carnies did the first strike.
    So, blame can be placed as usual :mrgreen:

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:59 am 
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    There is going to be so much fall out from everything that's happened here. Parson is going to be feeling the pain if Antium isn't saved, seeing more people sacrifice themselves from him, the magic kingdom is up in arms, the Tool needs to figure out exactly how he feels about Parson. And then there's Charlie. Jack. They need weeks to sort it all out and with so much of their army dead and Charlie showing his hand, there's no way they're going to get that time

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:15 am 
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    Interesting how the dominant, powerful, implacable Wanda is being so quiet in the middle of all this action. Probably just admirable restraint....or something deeper.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:17 am 
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    Considering her previous relationship with Marie, it makes sense that Wanda would cede the floor.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:29 am 
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    Now you be a good time to frame Charlie for the recent antics. Say he dropped a suggestion on Parson to pull this ploy. And look, the magic kingdom is suddenly fighting. And now he jams communication? Must be the prelude to an attack. We should probably have a dirtamancer roll an inferno generating bomb in through the portal.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:35 am 
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    Alright, I'm going to complete the work I did last episode.

    Last episode, I suggested Jack was still alive and had cast Foolamancy to hide teh bracer's true answer. I suggested he was not dead.

    There was another possibility. But it lead to a bit of information that was not provable, and I didn't want to get into a discussion on it. That info just happened.

    Marie Predicted Parson's attempt to use the Scroll, and knew she needed it to be stopped.

    So, Jack isn't alive. The one thing we have never seen is what Marie told Jack about his future, while both were in FAQ. Nothing at all on that.

    So, now we know that Marie has Predicted it. It is not a stretch for her to tell Jack he needs to cast a spell to hide the bracer's answers, and he needs to do it the next time he sees Parson in the MK. Which he did while Parson was distracted watching Jack's rolling head after faking the portal close. There was absolutely no reason for Jack to waste his last juice on a joke. This was the reason: to stop Parson from leaving ErfWorld. And the reason why it was so hard for Parson to see the real numbers?

    A Level 3 Warlord trying to see through a Master-class Veil. I can't imagine the chance was very high of it happening.

    So, Jack is dead. We no longer have to introduce any new elements. Everything we need to understand what just happened is right there for us.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:46 am 
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    I really think that's reaching, to infer a conspiracy between Jack and Marie from what we've seen.

    The deal with Fate is that it is indistinguishable from random events, and reveals itself in entirely subjective terms.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:01 am 
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    I agree with Kreistor that Jack is involved with the bracer. Also, I bet anything that Antium is Jack. Here is why:

    1) Antium was around when Parson was making his calculations, and therefore had the opportunity to cast foolamancy to change the bracer results.
    2) Jack would have every reason to do this, because Duty requires him to act to save his side, and keeping Parson, the perfect warlord, around would help do that.
    3) Antium knew that Parson would survive going through the portal. How could some rank-and-file soldiers know that Parson would survive, when they normally think that all non-casters who go into the magic kingdom die automatically? No regular soldier would push Parson through because they would think he would die.

    I think the whole "active fate" thing discussed in the previous page's reactions is foolishness. If "fate" were to cause the bracer to read 0.0, then no original number would appear. In other words, the bracer would simply read 0.0, because fate dictates that Parson would be unable to cast the spell. There would be no first number that changes into a second number.

    Also it doesn't make sense that Jack would ride a dragon into a wall and then just die. Jack is smarter than that.

    Also, and this is pretty story-meta, we still haven't found out what "trick" Jack used to get into (out of?) Spacerock. If Jack is dead, we will never get that payoff. I bet the "trick" is that Jack never left Spacerock, but sent some kind of illusion through the portal. That's why he didn't die when the portal closed. Notice also that Jack announced to all of the casters at the portal that he had no juice left. This might have been a trick to fool Charlie into thinking that Jack is no longer active in Spacerock.

    Just my two cents...

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:15 am 
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    How weird, this new page reminds me of Delphie Temple, specifically where the healomancer says "How did you..." Like "How did you know a warlord would come back through this gate?" With the other info we've seen, I think it implies that in general, predictomancers have little control over the predictions they make, and the other magician is surprised that Marie could make so many fine-tune predictions in a row (Parson's coming, going, winning, coming back and injured). Or possibly that this particular caster doesn't understand how predictomancy works.

    That reminded me of how Delphie and Marie both fought in actual battles, predicting the immediate future of enemy movements to boost accuracy. Whereas Olive Branch fought like a hippiemancer. Each won a victory against the other.

    The point being that Olive Branch's type of fighting always reminded me of a Magic: The Gathering deck called TurboFog. The idea was that you didn't win by dealing damage to the opponent (the traditional method), you won by playing a card called Fog (negates all combat damage this turn). Normally this would be a losing strategy, but that's where the turbo comes in: you drop down Howling Mine and something Chalice, which both force both you and your opponent to draw more cards, starting with them. This both allows you to draw more fog cards as needed, and also elegantly provides your win condition: because the opponent starts drawing more first, they deck out first (another lose condition). And the whole time they're drawing more cards they can't beat you with damage because you just Fog (or use any of the 3-4 expies with a different name) every turn. It won tournaments because many decks had no effective counter to it, even including sideboard cards (cards that can be subbed in between games of a best-of-3 match). However, a traditional deck could still win if it was efficient enough or got lucky.

    In this world, most sides had no idea how to deal with Olive Branch's turbofog strategy, even if they knew to prepare against it, and so it steamrolled them.

    Possible conclusion: Parson may be one of the first people in Erfworld to be able to play speed chess on his level, hence his power, and why he is a polarizing force.

    I'm sorry if I'm just repeating old arguments. I have just needed to get that out for a while.

    On a side note: I was expecting Parson to be dead after the last text update, and Wanda to go through the portal and revive him. That would have been fascinating, and added extreme tension to the question of how "alive" uncroaked units are, and whether Jill can turn Ansem. And I was also curious what Parson's personality would be like as an uncroaked unit, and whether he'd be able to return home (as I'm sure he would have been also, which would have been interesting to read). Will he still croak now?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:21 am 
    E is for Erfworld Supporter Print Book 2 & Draw Book 3 Supporter This user was a Tool before it was cool This user is a Tool! Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
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    Kreistor wrote:
    Alright, I'm going to complete the work I did last episode.

    Last episode, I suggested Jack was still alive and had cast Foolamancy to hide teh bracer's true answer. I suggested he was not dead.

    There was another possibility. But it lead to a bit of information that was not provable, and I didn't want to get into a discussion on it. That info just happened.

    Marie Predicted Parson's attempt to use the Scroll, and knew she needed it to be stopped.

    So, Jack isn't alive. The one thing we have never seen is what Marie told Jack about his future, while both were in FAQ. Nothing at all on that.

    So, now we know that Marie has Predicted it. It is not a stretch for her to tell Jack he needs to cast a spell to hide the bracer's answers, and he needs to do it the next time he sees Parson in the MK. Which he did while Parson was distracted watching Jack's rolling head after faking the portal close. There was absolutely no reason for Jack to waste his last juice on a joke. This was the reason: to stop Parson from leaving ErfWorld. And the reason why it was so hard for Parson to see the real numbers?

    A Level 3 Warlord trying to see through a Master-class Veil. I can't imagine the chance was very high of it happening.

    So, Jack is dead. We no longer have to introduce any new elements. Everything we need to understand what just happened is right there for us.


    Oh, yeah. That's a splendid theory, Kreistor! Except, wait. It's impossible.

    Lets look at a few established facts.

    -Foolamancers have to be in a hex to veil it.
    -Jack's illusions have cut off before when he was incapacitated by arrows.
    -In order to mislead Olive, he had to end the illusion giving Jillian vision.

    All this points out to me that foolamancy must have active focus on it to function -unless it is crafted into a magic item like the eye books-

    It cannot be used as a programmed deception, ESPECIALLY WHEN THE CASTER IS DEAD. Even altering the eyebook required him to link up with Maggie, and took time and effort, and further the book already contained Eyemancy. There is basically no precedent for your theory of him altering Parson's bracer on a fundamental level, withou touching it or Parson noticing.

    Can we drop the Jack is Mastermind tangent now?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:23 am 
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    For me, this update has reinforced the idea/theory that Janis might be Olive.

    Goshen wrote:
    Interesting how the dominant, powerful, implacable Wanda is being so quiet in the middle of all this action. Probably just admirable restraint....or something deeper.


    Also, about Wanda, I was thinking the same about her not engaging but then remembered that even though it was a long time for us, the last we've seen of her was right after Ossomer turned. If you consider how it backlashed on her after Jillian broke the suggestion spell you might think she is still kind of in shock to take active action in all the events going on in the MK right now.

    jah77 wrote:
    3) Antium knew that Parson would survive going through the portal. How could some rank-and-file soldiers know that Parson would survive, when they normally think that all non-casters who go into the magic kingdom die automatically? No regular soldier would push Parson through because they would think he would die.


    Remember Antium was told by Wanda and Jack that Parson could cross through the MK, he saw Parson getting to Spacerock through the Portal and also heard Parson mentioning both Parson and Jack could get back to the MK to escape the Inferno so even though I'm not specifically disagreeing with the possibility of that theory being correct, I don't think Antium pushing Parson through the Portal would support your view in the way you claim.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:24 am 
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    jah77 wrote:
    3) Antium knew that Parson would survive going through the portal. How could some rank-and-file soldiers know that Parson would survive, when they normally think that all non-casters who go into the magic kingdom die automatically? No regular soldier would push Parson through because they would think he would die.

    Antium saw Parson come through the portal on the Spacerock side. Problem solved.

    EDIT: Oh come on, can't I be the first to say anything?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:36 am 
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    Not Me wrote:
    For me, this update has reinforced the idea/theory that Janis might be Olive.

    Goshen wrote:
    Interesting how the dominant, powerful, implacable Wanda is being so quiet in the middle of all this action. Probably just admirable restraint....or something deeper.


    Also, about Wanda, I was thinking the same about her not engaging but then remembered that even though it was a long time for us, the last we've seen of her was right after Ossomer turned. If you consider how it backlashed on her after Jillian broke the suggestion spell you might think she is still kind of in shock to take active action in all the events going on in the MK right now.

    jah77 wrote:
    3) Antium knew that Parson would survive going through the portal. How could some rank-and-file soldiers know that Parson would survive, when they normally think that all non-casters who go into the magic kingdom die automatically? No regular soldier would push Parson through because they would think he would die.


    Remember Antium was told by Wanda and Jack that Parson could cross through the MK, he saw Parson getting to Spacerock through the Portal and also heard Parson mentioning both Parson and Jack could get back to the MK to escape the Inferno so even though I'm not specifically disagreeing with the possibility of that theory being correct, I don't think Antium pushing Parson through the Portal would support your view in the way you claim.


    In that same comic, we:
    1) Do not see Jack go BACK through the portal to be with Parson (Parson is surprised that Jack is there); and
    2) See Jack tell Parson to stack with Antium (i.e., stack with Jack).

    How many more hints do you need?

    EDIT:
    Also, this comic appears to be the birth of Jack's plan (he decides to employ a little "lateral thinking"). We have never seen what Jack's plan is. After Jack hatches this plan, his face appears outside the portal. This implies that there is some sort of trickery involved with him sticking his head out.


    Last edited by jah77 on Mon May 27, 2013 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:39 am 
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    Guys, on strip #107 Stanley acknowledged Parson spent a caster. He ought to know, Jack is dead.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:41 am 
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    teratorn wrote:
    Guys, on strip #107 Stanley acknowledged Parson spent a caster. He ought to know, Jack is dead.

    Stanlety said "a caster" and not "Jack" or "the foolamancer."

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 110
     Post Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:42 am 
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    Any ideas on the green recycle symbol on the last frame?

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