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 Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
 Post Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:07 am 
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effataigus wrote:
Rulers have natural thinkamancy that lets them pass along simple orders at a distance. Remember, not every side has a thinkamancer. Stanley could issue the order for all units to return home... which would mean Parson and the casters would leave the units trapped in JS to burn.

Not true, this is part of the reason you have Warlords. You can issue contingent orders when a unit is in your presence, but once they have left the hex you need to message them somehow (Hats, scouts with notes, or Thinkamancy) in order to have new orders.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:47 pm 
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    0beron wrote:
    effataigus wrote:
    Rulers have natural thinkamancy that lets them pass along simple orders at a distance. Remember, not every side has a thinkamancer. Stanley could issue the order for all units to return home... which would mean Parson and the casters would leave the units trapped in JS to burn.

    Not true, this is part of the reason you have Warlords. You can issue contingent orders when a unit is in your presence, but once they have left the hex you need to message them somehow (Hats, scouts with notes, or Thinkamancy) in order to have new orders.
    Ah, the note-scout. Hmm, I'll spend some time next time I have a stable connection going back and trying to find the passage that gave me the impression that overlords could issue orders remotely. I'll post it here if I find it.

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    Last edited by effataigus on Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:31 am, edited 239044 times in total.


    Last edited by effataigus on Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:50 pm 
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    effataigus wrote:
    0beron wrote:
    effataigus wrote:
    Rulers have natural thinkamancy that lets them pass along simple orders at a distance. Remember, not every side has a thinkamancer. Stanley could issue the order for all units to return home... which would mean Parson and the casters would leave the units trapped in JS to burn.

    Not true, this is part of the reason you have Warlords. You can issue contingent orders when a unit is in your presence, but once they have left the hex you need to message them somehow (Hats, scouts with notes, or Thinkamancy) in order to have new orders.
    Citation? Overlords have remote knowledge of the status of their units. I admit I assumed that this gave them the ability to issue orders as well, but looking back on it I can't recall why I thought that. However, I also don't recall any evidence for your statement.


    Other than whenever commands or requests for clarification of commands are issued over a distance they are sent via hat or thinkamancer? None at all, I suppose.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:53 pm 
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    joosy wrote:
    ....

    Whoa, you are too fast... I remembered the note-scout right after posting that... which is the only example I can think of a RULER that doesn't have a thinkamancer sending information long distances at all... anyhow, I updated the post in light of that. See the current text.

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    Last edited by effataigus on Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:31 am, edited 239044 times in total.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:10 pm 
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    effataigus wrote:
    0beron wrote:
    effataigus wrote:
    Rulers have natural thinkamancy that lets them pass along simple orders at a distance. Remember, not every side has a thinkamancer. Stanley could issue the order for all units to return home... which would mean Parson and the casters would leave the units trapped in JS to burn.

    Not true, this is part of the reason you have Warlords. You can issue contingent orders when a unit is in your presence, but once they have left the hex you need to message them somehow (Hats, scouts with notes, or Thinkamancy) in order to have new orders.
    Ah, the note-scout. Hmm, I'll spend some time next time I have a stable connection going back and trying to find the passage that gave me the impression that overlords could issue orders remotely. I'll post it here if I find it.
    When Parson was talking to Vurp, he learned that chiefs of natural tribes had their orders relayed by natural thinkamancy. However they are not rulers, and probably not even all considered chief warlords or chief casters.

    I do still wonder what happens when a natural side gets a capital. Do they gain a treasury and are now allowed to pop of other types from the city? Do the types change some to reflect the tribe? Do they gain a ruler? Do they lose the normal natural unit popping ability? All these answers and more in the next episode of Parson vs. Vurp.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:52 pm 
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    joosy wrote:
    effataigus wrote:
    Not true, this is part of the reason you have Warlords. You can issue contingent orders when a unit is in your presence, but once they have left the hex you need to message them somehow (Hats, scouts with notes, or Thinkamancy) in order to have new orders.
    Citation? Overlords have remote knowledge of the status of their units. I admit I assumed that this gave them the ability to issue orders as well, but looking back on it I can't recall why I thought that. However, I also don't recall any evidence for your statement.


    Other than whenever commands or requests for clarification of commands are issued over a distance they are sent via hat or thinkamancer? None at all, I suppose.[/quote]
    Closest I remember was the note Tram got when he was gummed up notifying him he was the new CWL (Book 2 - Page 12). But that on a side that had a hat magician, and could have been sent via hat off panel.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:48 am 
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    I was actually thinking Stanley would make Parson his heir, myself. This would gum up Charlie's plan something fierce, if Charlie's plan is as predicted. *Shrugs*

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 10:15 am 
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    effataigus wrote:
    joosy wrote:
    ....

    Whoa, you are too fast... I remembered the note-scout right after posting that... which is the only example I can think of a RULER that doesn't have a thinkamancer sending information long distances at all... anyhow, I updated the post in light of that. See the current text.
    Came up with another instance of a ruler using a hat when he wouldn't have had to (Banhammer recalling Jillian, admittedly by a very specific route). Also couldn't find the counter evidence that I thought I was remembering... so I'm now with ya'll in believing that the preponderance of the evidence suggests that the natural thinkamancy of overlords cannot order units about beyond the hex that they are in.

    Perhaps I was remembering what you suggested, Lamech!

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:17 pm 
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    effataigus wrote:
    wrecan wrote:
    Direcoyote wrote:
    I also think that Stanley might do something to throw a spanner into the works.

    That would be a remarkable feat given that it is not Gobwin Knob's turn, so he can't leave Gobwin Knob, and he is virtually all alone (certainly without casters) in Gobwin Knob and his thinkamancer is out of juice. The only thing I could imagine is if Stanley suddenly discovers a new power of the Arkenhammer (such as telepathically controlling even decrypted dwagons at infinite distance), or if he totally boops it up by disbanding Parson in anger (and thus returning him to Stupid World).

    Rulers have natural thinkamancy that lets them pass along simple orders at a distance. Remember, not every side has a thinkamancer. Stanley could issue the order for all units to return home... which would mean Parson and the casters would leave the units trapped in JS to burn.

    Even if Stanley could issue an order form sucha distance (and I don't think he can), it's not their turn. They cannot leave the hex.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:21 pm 
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    wrecan wrote:
    It's not [GK's] turn. They cannot leave the hex.

    ....Parson and company are in the MK right now which doesn't count as a hex. So if somehow they received an order from Stanley, they can and would have to return to GK city.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:42 pm 
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    0beron wrote:
    wrecan wrote:
    It's not [GK's] turn. They cannot leave the hex.

    ....Parson and company are in the MK right now which doesn't count as a hex. So if somehow they received an order from Stanley, they can and would have to return to GK city.

    Only if they can, which they can't once through the portal if Slately then seals it by switching capitals, and we've already been informed that Parson will go through that Portal.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:45 pm 
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    Well then that would be an issue of lacking a path, not an issue of being off-turn.

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    GJC wrote:
    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 4:32 pm 
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    effataigus wrote:
    Came up with another instance of a ruler using a hat when he wouldn't have had to (Banhammer recalling Jillian, admittedly by a very specific route).


    Also Don to Vinney, using Bunny.
    Maybe you can give orders but not talk/give direction.
    So attack/defend/go seem to be possible and you know what state the unit is in. Is it idle/busy/in combat/injured.
    But not more detailed stuff like "tell me what you see", "ok attack the group on the left".

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:58 pm 
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    Rulers can give eorders to their units wherever, whenever.

    http://www.erfworld.com/wiki/index.php/LIAB_Text_44

    Rulers have a natural Thinkamancy which allows them to relay orders to their field units, even without a Thinkamancer. He had an feel for what was going on with his forces, even sitting there in a chair in his capital's garrison's larder. But he didn't know what to make of it.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 5:37 am 
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    Thank you, Itoh. This is exactly how Stanley was able to capture Jillian in Book 1. "She ended turn in the trees, and I pulled together a nearby flight of dwagons." Stanley couldn't have pulled together that flight without the ability to pass orders to units in the field. Thus: Natural thinkamancy.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 94
     Post Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 8:36 am 
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    Actually no, the Jillian capture is not proof of this mechanic, because he had the Eyemancers functioning then. But Itoh's example does prove it.

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