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 Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:59 am 
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I would bet against predictamancy here. I think it's simply that Charlie sees what Parson is.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:02 am 
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    Yeah, I don't think it's Predictamancy. I think it's just Charlie realizing that Parson is the only mind in Erfworld that is a match for his own, and therefore a serious threat.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:03 am 
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    The artwork is great, the symbolism of the villains is a great touch, but most importantly, we now have a time frame on Clonely. Charlie states the double will "vanish" at the beginning of Jetstone's next turn. So not the end of this turn, but beginning of next. Also Charlie clearly saw the events from the eyes of the doombat. Meaning that the doombats are like CCTV with an open link that anyone who has the proper knowledge/capabilities can tap into.

    The word "vanish" is of not as well the use of "kill" We have heard of croaking, dusting, and disbanding many times, but this does seem to be the first use of either word in this context. Looking for context in the comic, I actually, I take that back, in Summer Update 43 http://www.erfworld.com/2009/10/summer-updates-043 at the end it describes the Unaroyal Field Units "have vanished" So does vanishing relate directly to disbanding? Does the dupe king have an upkeep cost? Could he possibly be maintained by the Dittomancer for more than a turn?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:07 am 
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    I have a question here.

    Charlie said he saved Jetstone twice in that battle: the first time was the end-turning spell; what was the second time?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:08 am 
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    Haggar?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:10 am 
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    danhaas wrote:
    Charlie said he saved Jetstone twice in that battle: the first time was the end-turning spell; what was the second time?

    It could even be argued he saved them many other times. I believe he is referring to his blackmail of Hagar, which forced them to fight and weaken the GK infantry column.
    He could also take credit for buffing up Jillian, making her a valuable asset during the earlier part of the battle, and he could take credit for holding up Parson which buys Jetstone more time.

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    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:11 am 
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    My vote for Panel 8 is Geppetto, the puppetmaster turned evil emperor from the Fables comics.

    Also, no predictamancy involved. Charlie has been tapping into Thinkamancy/Thinkagrams for a while now. We -- the audience -- have only recently been made aware.

    Didn't The Joker show up as one of the background -mancers in the Magic Kingdom, or am I misremembering?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:11 am 
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    Crash wrote:
    Could he possibly be maintained by the Dittomancer for more than a turn?

    I would guess that its similar to uncroaked units, where if the duration of the unit I based on the initia cast and can't be extended afterward

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:12 am 
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    Ambug666 wrote:
    Didn't The Joker show up as one of the background -mancers in the Magic Kingdom, or am I misremembering?

    It's possible. Rob isn't above using a reference twice in different ways (Case and point, Jack is a constant reference to the Joker). OR, this could mean Charlie is also a Foolamancer at some level, and he has been to the MK using that disguise.

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    GJC wrote:
    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
    There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:30 am 
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    Nice twisty plot line!

    I may be in the minority but I hope Jetstone falls. I've never been a fan of any sort of royal/royalty. That said, I have my suspicions that the double is being duped. Has Charlie really ever been a straight shooter?

    This comic is great on so many levels!

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:42 am 
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    0beron wrote:
    Ambug666 wrote:
    Didn't The Joker show up as one of the background -mancers in the Magic Kingdom, or am I misremembering?

    It's possible. Rob isn't above using a reference twice in different ways (Case and point, Jack is a constant reference to the Joker). OR, this could mean Charlie is also a Foolamancer at some level, and he has been to the MK using that disguise.


    Countdown to someone speculating that Jack is really Charlie in 3...2...1...

    Seriously, that raises a good point about how pop culture can be grafted onto Erfworld in different ways. Jack dresses like the Ceasar Romero Joker -- the Clown Prince of Crime, an amusing prankster carrying at worst a vague air of menace. When Charlie manifests as the Joker, it's the Heath Ledger version, a terrifying force of chaotic destruction, mass murder with a smile. Good stuff.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:47 am 
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    This has been a long time coming but I just want to say:

    I TOTALLY called this over a year ago! :D

    viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3034&start=100#p59913

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:08 pm 
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    I'm not sure I like Charlie very much any more. He's blatantly lying, and treating poor Slately like his pawn.

    Everyone is leaping on the idea that using the word "Kill" must mean he is from Earth. But I've had an alternate theory for some time now.

    When Parson broke the filter at the end of the first book, it in a very small way started to crack apart erfworld's cutesy nature. That act has caused ripples in the world's language, at least. Do you recall a while back, Stanley was struggling to find a curse word that started with F? Like it was at the tip of his tongue, but he didn't yet know exactly what he was looking for.

    Perhaps "Kill" here is another sign of the breaking filters.

    That and it rhymes with "Kill the batman"

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:14 pm 
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    Kaed wrote:
    Everyone is leaping on the idea that using the word "Kill" must mean he is from Earth. But I've had an alternate theory for some time now...it rhymes with "Kill the batman"

    Agreed...the use of kill isn't was says he's from Stupid-world. His multiple villain references do. Erfworld's signamancy reflects stupidworld...but here we are in a space totally controlled by Charlie. Any appearances will come from his mind.

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    GJC wrote:
    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
    There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:17 pm 
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    Wow, Charlie is serious about removing Parson. Why do I feel that Charlie is just mad someone got a better toy and since he cannot have it he wants to destroy it. I feel that since the updates between book 1 and 2 Charlie and Parson have not been talking because Parson has proven to be a danger to Charlie by omission. This means that every time Parson and Charlie ever talk Charlie takes the serious risk of reviling information to Parson and from what we have seen Charlie hates giving out information for free. His reaction also gives us a clue that he is from Earth like Parson and I am willing to bet Parson also thinks so. So that raises the question of what the spell Jojo was going to cast what it actually going to do. I loved the art work of Charlie's different forms.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:24 pm 
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    0beron wrote:
    Kaed wrote:
    Everyone is leaping on the idea that using the word "Kill" must mean he is from Earth. But I've had an alternate theory for some time now...it rhymes with "Kill the batman"

    Agreed...the use of kill isn't was says he's from Stupid-world. His multiple villain references do. Erfworld's signamancy reflects stupidworld...but here we are in a space totally controlled by Charlie. Any appearances will come from his mind.


    It's interesting, though, that he picked Beetlejuice for one of his appearances. He seems very out of place in their ranks, I think. He's more of a trickster than an out-and-out villain. Heck, they even made him the hero in the cartoon series.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:27 pm 
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    0beron wrote:
    danhaas wrote:
    Charlie said he saved Jetstone twice in that battle: the first time was the end-turning spell; what was the second time?

    It could even be argued he saved them many other times. I believe he is referring to his blackmail of Hagar, which forced them to fight and weaken the GK infantry column.
    He could also take credit for buffing up Jillian, making her a valuable asset during the earlier part of the battle, and he could take credit for holding up Parson which buys Jetstone more time.


    Haggar wasn't a threat to Jetstone nor Gobwin Knob. Their plan was to stand outside the battle and croak the surviving units of the battle, once it had ended.

    Yes, Charlie forced Haggar to fight and prevented that plan, but I don't think that counts as saving Jetstone. After the time-warp, the units across the river were outmatched and the flying units were sitting ducks. Before the free-falling units inside the city, Jetstone hardly needed any saving.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:36 pm 
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    danhaas wrote:
    Haggar wasn't a threat to Jetstone nor Gobwin Knob.

    They were a threat to Jetstone by extention. The Infantry from GK was prepared to assault the city, getting Haggar to step in was supposed to thin their numbers enough to diminish the GK threat. GK dealt with it pretty well though, so Charlie had to resort to kingworld instead.

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    GJC wrote:
    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
    There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:43 pm 
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    It's interesting that Tramennis asks "saved for how long?" It makes it seem he doesn't have confidence in being made a heir....

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 89
     Post Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:44 pm 
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    0beron wrote:
    danhaas wrote:
    Haggar wasn't a threat to Jetstone nor Gobwin Knob.

    They were a threat to Jetstone by extention. The Infantry from GK was prepared to assault the city, getting Haggar to step in was supposed to thin their numbers enough to diminish the GK threat. GK dealt with it pretty well though, so Charlie had to resort to kingworld instead.


    Actually, that logic is backwards. Kingworld happened before charlie strong-armed Haggar into thinning out the GK column. (and even that was presumably only because his pet queen didn't follow his gameplan)

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