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 Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 1:33 am 
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Kaed wrote:
Is that twoll brain damaged? I'm starting to wonder if something is up with him lately.

I know twolls aren't generally bright sure but... wow. Just wow. He's being a retard.

I PUT BREAD IN FACE DURR

With such a name it can't be any other way (=

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 1:49 am 
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    Housellama wrote:
    kefkakrazy wrote:
    I'm inclined to agree that Zhopa is probably smarter than he acts, though we have some evidence to show that Twolls in general are dumb as a post and that Bogroll was a pretty exceptional example. (Him being brainy for a twoll might account for him getting picked on by the other minions, too)

    I get this as Stanley deciding "I'll find you a Duty you'll hate" and Zhopa quietly agreeing with him. Instead of facepalm, we get facebread.

    On the other hand, it's possible Zhopa IS that dumb.


    Well, Stanley DID say "Break" when the Twoll had the bread in his hands. Maybe the Twoll interpreted that as an order to him as well?

    I have a theory about Duty and Loyalty affecting the actions and attitudes of lower level units, but I can't really put it into coherent words at 2330. Stanley is pretty aimless right now. Zhopa's Duty and Loyalty right now is focused on Stanley. Maggie, Jack and Co have Duty to the side, but Loyalty mostly to Parson. And Parson has a very clear purpose. So they have a very clear purpose. All the Decrypted are Loyal to Wanda, and she has a very clear purpose as well. Perhaps because Stanley is aimless, that aimlessness is reflected on those units loyal to Stanley.

    Just a theory. Feedback welcome.


    This goes back to Stanley's basic insecurities. However Stanley is also being a typical ruler much like Stately was up until this turn. What I think is going on is the shifting in roles Stanley into a "Stately style" and Stately trying to channel an inner Stanley. Remember Stanley came up from a mere pike so this is a role reversal.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 2:14 am 
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    Ok, now we know that the Hippymancer conspiracy and the Great Minds are both taken by surprise at the appearance of George (Georgiechew?). That's a point in favor of the Charlie theory, though i'm hoping it's something else.

    We also have confirmation that a ruler's natural ability to keep tabs on their subordinates is discontinuous; it took several seconds for it to lock in on Parson's new location.

    And, as others have speculated, Stanley's need to be directly involved has the potential to mess things up.

    There's also some good comedy coming. I see Stanley having Zhopa carry him in a shoulder mounted platform, and then order the twoll to go somewhere that involves a low (by twoll standards) doorway. I think the big Z is going to find his new position frustrating and aggravating.

    And the next comic? I predict that Parson will notice George, but George will be pinned down by multiple direct mind control spells and will only be able croak out something short and cryptic. Then Parson will finish his run and burst into Jetstone's Portal room, his momentum alone being enough to power through whatever JT forces make it down there. Perhaps he'll wipe out the Knights Who Wear Funny Helmets and take Trem prisoner.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 2:21 am 
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    All I thought when I read it is they are Perfect for each other.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 2:23 am 
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    atalex wrote:

    To expand on what others have said, I think the reason for Zhopa's behavior is that all he wants is to be left alone to do his job, but all day long he has been pestered with questions by his ruler, a guy who can disband him at will. Earlier, he feared that he might be punished or disbanded just for inadvertently offending Stanley by making the chair either too tall or not tall enough. And now, he is expected to constantly follow said ruler around and be subjected to such questions all the time! It's like Keef from Futurama on the first day he got promoted to being Zapp Brannigan's second-in-command, except that (a) Zhopa doesn't have Keef's wit and intellect to deal with the constant barrage of stupid and (b) Zapp doesn't have the authority to summarily execute Keef for any imagined offense.


    And Stanley doesn't have the legs for a skirt.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 2:29 am 
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    EDITED: Okay, misread that last bit.


    Last edited by Joe Falco on Mon May 23, 2011 2:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 2:32 am 
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    Joe Falco wrote:
    Seems to me that whatever caused the gobwins to rebel against Saline IV is happening again.

    And yeah, I'd say it's Charlie. With what's going with Parson and now with Stanley, this can't be just some random joke thrown in. There was a reason why Zhopa looked up at the ceiling before whacking Stanley with bread. Either he's receiving orders of magical persuasion from afar or he's getting them from right above him.


    Zhopa did not whack Stanley with the bread, he whacked himself with the bread.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 2:35 am 
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    ftl wrote:
    Joe Falco wrote:
    Seems to me that whatever caused the gobwins to rebel against Saline IV is happening again.

    And yeah, I'd say it's Charlie. With what's going with Parson and now with Stanley, this can't be just some random joke thrown in. There was a reason why Zhopa looked up at the ceiling before whacking Stanley with bread. Either he's receiving orders of magical persuasion from afar or he's getting them from right above him.


    Zhopa did not whack Stanley with the bread, he whacked himself with the bread.


    I think your overthinkingthis

    Zhopa is terrified of Spending time with Lord Staneley. Note his looking longingly at an escape route, and how nervous he has been up till now.

    And now Stanley is asking him weird questions he lacks the cognitive ability to answer quickly. Putting him on the spot and making him more nervous.

    And somehow, he answered in ways that mean now he has to stick by this man ALL THE TIME.

    Facebread time. He's not sure how, but Zhopa knows he screwed up big.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 3:00 am 
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    I'd say it's simply that Zhoppa, faced with the prospect of serving as Stanley's lackey, has opted for the sane route by attempting to beat himself to death with the nearest available object. Unfortunately, that object was bread, and probably not even french bread, much less dwarfish bread...

    For his part, Stanley is trying to become something more. Ever since Jack saved him during the ambush, Stanley has shown more and more interest in becoming a better leader. He is trying to remember names, he is trying to see them as more than pawns... Unfortunately, Zhoppa isn't the sterling conversationalist Bogroll was, and that fact is getting him into deeper and deeper trouble as Stanley becomes more intent on forging a connection. I don't know if this new enlightenment is a good thing or not, as Parson has observed before that Stanley is a master at getting in the way of his own goals.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 3:17 am 
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    atalex wrote:
    Kaed wrote:
    Is that twoll brain damaged? I'm starting to wonder if something is up with him lately.

    I know twolls aren't generally bright sure but... wow. Just wow. He's being a retard.

    I PUT BREAD IN FACE DURR


    To expand on what others have said, I think the reason for Zhopa's behavior is that all he wants is to be left alone to do his job, but all day long he has been pestered with questions by his ruler, a guy who can disband him at will. Earlier, he feared that he might be punished or disbanded just for inadvertently offending Stanley by making the chair either too tall or not tall enough. And now, he is expected to constantly follow said ruler around and be subjected to such questions all the time!


    Yes, this. The term "Facebread" is pretty good one actually.

    Quote:
    It's like Keef from Futurama


    You mean Kif. Kif Kroker.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kif_Kroker

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 5:22 am 
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    It IS like Kif! Perfect comparison! I think the comparison of Stanley and Zap meks it perfect, though, Kif and Zappo or Zippa or whatever his name is are too different.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 5:53 am 
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    Calemyr wrote:
    I don't know if this new enlightenment is a good thing or not, as Parson has observed before that Stanley is a master at getting in the way of his own goals.


    Oh c'mon give the man a break. Yes he isn't perfect, but his side is still standing and powerfull, so he's doing something right.

    Actually, let's compare Stanley with the other rulers out there shall we?

    Economics

    Stanley: takes care to don't waste money needlessly. Makes sure to keep a fat treasury for hard times, wich comes in handy for hiring supreme warlords, mass promotion of heavies, scrolls for the casters and other essential stuff. Even when cornered against the wall, Stanley still had quite a good chunk of pocket change.

    Statley: Spends money like water on pretty structures and couriers. When cornered, finds himself bankrupt.

    Don: Spends money like water on other sides. Unreliable unstable sides that give low chance of a profitable return. Almost bankrupted his own kingdom if not for his leadership corps steping in.

    Jillian: Can barely afford basic services, needs constant supplies from other sides.

    Command Under Pressure

    Stanley: Knows when to run and when to fight. If he hadn't pulled out from GK when the coalition giant mob arrived, Hamster wouldn't be able to use the hax volcano (as stanley couldn't be pulled to the safety of the magic kingdom), and they would've lost. When ambushed by Transyvilto, quickly decided to break trough instead of fighting to the death.

    Statley: When cornered, decides that suicide rush while bankrupting an ally is a good plan. Instead of one of his experienced warlords, puts in command a pretty diplomacy boy that shoots down his own troops and then runs screaming towards the enemy artillery geting knocked out.

    Don: Puts himself into a pretty bad position by burning all his resources towards other side that its renowed for their unreliability and chaotic behaviour.

    Jillian:
    Has to rely on other sides to cover her ass.


    Natural Leadership


    Stanley: Will you admit it or not, Stanley has loads of natural leadership. Every one of his subordinates is willing to fight to the last breath rather than even think about betrayng him. Both Jack and Wanda had multiple chances to surrender out of a hopeless situations but choosed to stand and fight for Stanley.

    Statley: Is seen as his side's simple accountant.

    Don: his own leadership corps banded togheter to put a stop to his plans. Need I say more?

    Jillian: Has to make extensive use of mind rape to get her troops to follow.


    Conclusion:
    So ok Stanley has some communication problems. But he excells at battle instinct, knows how to get his subordinates unquestionable loyalty and makes sure to keep his side economically stable. His side is thus in a much better position now than either the two other sides we know in detail so far.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 6:17 am 
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    YAY Stanley! It's nice to see the little guy try to get back in the loop. Shine on you crazy diamond!

    Dr Pepper wrote:
    And Stanley doesn't have the legs for a skirt.


    How would you know? We have yet to see Stanley ride into battle the way nature intended.

    abb3w wrote:
    Stanley the Plaid, Overlord of Gobwin Knob and Tool of the Titans wrote:
    "Wow, yeah. Seems like nothing has happened around here in ages! 'Mean this day has just been crawling, m'I right?"

    ...the titans wax ironic at the slow pace of updates as well. :lol:


    It was my favourite gag of the update :oops:

    oslecamo2_temp wrote:
    Oh c'mon give {Stanley} a break. Yes he isn't perfect, but his side is still standing and powerfull, so he's doing something right.

    Actually, let's compare Stanley with the other rulers out there shall we?

    Economics

    Stanley: takes care to don't waste money needlessly. Makes sure to keep a fat treasury for hard times, wich comes in handy for hiring supreme warlords, mass promotion of heavies, scrolls for the casters and other essential stuff. Even when cornered against the wall, Stanley still had quite a good chunk of pocket change.


    Meh, it depends. The other leaders in your analysis don't fare well, but miserliness is not always better than profligacy (yeah I looked those up on wiktionary).

    The ur-example is RTSs (bear with me for a moment). In Starcraft (1), having more money than needed for one command structure was often a bad idea- it meant you weren't churning out enough units/upgrades. Part of this logic applies to TBS games, or worlds with TBS-like physics, as long as one simple condition applies: there are limits to how much you can build/pop/buy in one turn. Therefore, if you cannot spend your entire massive treasury all at once, it doesn't make sense to hoard too much, then find out that you can recruit 1000 Archons but oops, they'll be ready in 5 turns whereas the enemy has enough forces at your door to croak you now.

    Granted, a lot of things seem to be "instant" in Erfworld (exceptions: heirs, Archons (?) and possibly some other high-tier units require more turns).

    Anyway. The point is that some of Stanley's behaviours (hoarding Schmuckers, fleeing GK) turned out to be beneficial ... but not necessarily because Stanley deliberately looked for an optimal solution to a problem and stumbled upon said policies. It was not a calculated decision to store Schmuckers, I believe, nor was the reason for the flight from GK anything other than own-ass-saving and GK be damned.

    Where Stanley is lucky is in having subordinates that can transform his (ill-considered?) decisions into opportunities.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 7:19 am 
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    So Stanley just announced by thinkagram that he'd be in the portal room in a minute.

    If the caster assassination idea didn't make much sense earlier, it just got a bit more reasonable. 'Course, it'd have to be an improvisation, and Charlie's man on the scene is running towards trouble in the opposite direction.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 7:34 am 
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    He's going after Wanda.

    Oops, spoiler alert.


    Nah, I kid. Georgeftichew is actually an agent of the joosy/Morganth alliance sent there to croak Sylvia.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 8:21 am 
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    Awesome update, but like others I don't really get the 'breadface' maneuver.

    My best guess (again, like everyone else, after re-reading the thread) is that it's Zhopa's only possible expression of frustration/annoyance/dismay.

    I don't think he's doing it because of the 'break' order.



    Any caster that decides to go after 'vulnerable' Stanley seems like they would get a face full of lightning hammer.

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    Last edited by Beeskee on Mon May 23, 2011 9:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:05 am 
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    I thought it was something more like this.

    http://www.askmen.com/money/body_and_mi ... ehead.html

    An expression of "Hell yeah, let's kick ass"

    Quote:
    looked longingly at the doorway, which led to a parapet overlooking the city and was the nearest exit from the larder area. Then he sighed, nodded silently, and shrugged his huge shoulders.


    He obviously wants to fight rather than sit in the larder.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:12 am 
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    oslecamo2_temp wrote:
    Statley: When cornered, decides that suicide rush while bankrupting an ally is a good plan. Instead of one of his experienced warlords, puts in command a pretty diplomacy boy that shoots down his own troops and then runs screaming towards the enemy artillery geting knocked out.


    That... is the funniest thing I've seen all day.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:14 am 
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    Realworld reference, possibly intentional.

    "Zogby International" is a prominent market research and polling company, relying heavily on automated online questionaires. Odds are good that if you see an opinion poll result make the primetime news in the USA, it came from one of 4-5 firms, one of which is Zogby .

    "Prominent", not necessarily "Best". For those who care, Nate Silver's 538 site does a good job of measuring the quality of polling firms.

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     Post Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:39 am 
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    Beeskee wrote:
    Any caster that decides to go after 'vulnerable' Stanley seems like they would get a face full of lightning hammer.


    I would hope so. Stanley needs to get out and kick ass now and then, and this isn't likely to happen intentionally on GK's part.

    Erfword combat, for a game-like world, still seems a lot about getting the drop on someone though. I imagine a well-chosen shockamancy scroll could take Stanley out, high level warlord or not.

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