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 Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 1:51 am 
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0beron wrote:
Lipkin wrote:
Oberon: The Look/Find (conflicting reports I believe) in the link was a bloke named Hubble, was it not?
The Lookamancer was indeed Hubble, but we do have it confirmed that all 4 schools were involved in the spell in some fashion. Judy's case specifically mentioned all 4 in the same sentence, and different instances from the casters involved in Parson's case say all 4 collectively. We also know that a link was involved.
My personal theory is that Predictamancy isn't actually in the scroll, but merely provided guidance in the process. So we presumably had Hubble-Tisha-Findamancer, with Marie casting some spell at them. But whatever the precise method, it is clear that all 4 disciplines played a part in both instances of the spell.

Maybe it was Hubble/Tisha/Marie making the scroll, and it requires a Findamancer to cast? We know that it was Findmancy that Wanda was using, because she complained that she wasn't a Findamancer.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 1:56 am 
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    Shai_hulud wrote:
    The thinkamancers implied in a bonus page in the print version of book 1 that a Predictamancer was linked to a Thinkamancer at some point.
    Ah yes right you are, very interesting. I need to go looking because I recall a mention of Findamancy at another point though. Perhaps Tisha facilitated 2 different links in the process of making the spell. Such a multi-step process might explain why the method would have been "since lost" in the time between Judy being summoned and Wanda giving her Trial testimony.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 2:05 am 
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    Lipkin wrote:
    Maybe it was Hubble/Tisha/Marie making the scroll, and it requires a Findamancer to cast? We know that it was Findmancy that Wanda was using, because she complained that she wasn't a Findamancer.
    Ok, the citation I was thinking of was Marie and Janis in a text update before the tunnel dash through the MK, but they don't mention the Findamancer there. Lipkin may be onto something, if anyone else can find other places the creation of the spell is discussed though it'd be most helpful.

    It does certainly make a degree of sense, and has an interesting implication. It would mean that the scroll didn't actually summon Parson, but rather served as a tool to vastly broaden the range with which Wanda could search for a suitable Warlord. Personally I think that's giving Wanda a bit too much credit, because it would mean she was performing the very powerful Findamancy portion of the spell unassisted. From how she describes her first Dirtamancy scroll, it seems that scrolls instruct the caster and makes the magic make sense. If the scroll didn't have Findamancy written in, she was casting what was surely a master-class level Findamancy spell on her own. It's almost like...giving a wild person reading spectacles and telling them to read Dickens. Just because the scroll gave her the lens to look through, doesn't mean she'd understand how to summon the target when she Found it.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 2:18 am 
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    It's the one earlier, before Sizemore even goes through the portal to start digging the tunnel.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 2:30 am 
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    Shai_hulud wrote:
    It's the one earlier, before Sizemore even goes through the portal to start digging the tunnel.
    Can you link me? Because I found Text 37 which is Marie and Janis talking in the forest, and it only mentions Think, Look, and Predict in the context of the link.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 2:37 am 
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    Well shit. NVM then. :oops:

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 2:41 am 
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    0beron wrote:
    It would mean that the scroll didn't actually summon Parson, but rather served as a tool to vastly broaden the range with which Wanda could search for a suitable Warlord. Personally I think that's giving Wanda a bit too much credit, because it would mean she was performing the very powerful Findamancy portion of the spell unassisted.
    Wanda seemed to be aware that it was a bad idea. She even said, "We need a Findamancer," in Book 1, Page 6. She knew that she shouldn't be casting the spell, but she's capable of Findamancy and got through it. So as unlikely as it seems, the theory may actually be exactly right.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 3:02 am 
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    Shai_hulud wrote:
    Well shit. NVM then. :oops:
    Aw drat, I thought you had caught something I missed in another page. So that leaves us with 2 possibilities as far as I can imagine:
    • Lipkin's theory is right, and somehow Wanda successfully pulled off a spell way beyond her abilities despite having no assistance from the scroll (keep in mind that not only did she bring the right unit to Erfworld in one piece, but also "summoned" all the items to make him a proper unit)
    • Scrolls create some kind of stable medium into which spells can be imprinted, so that the scroll actually contained 2 separate spells woven closely together, one to allow her to "see" the exact unit that was Fated to succeed, and a second to guide her in actually summoning him. Meaning Tisha/Marie/Hubble made one spell, then unnamed Findamancer cast a second spell, and both fit onto one scroll.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 11:02 am 
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    Marie predicted that Wanda was the correct person to cast, did she not? If that's the case, she couldn't really fail. The long shot becomes certain.

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 11:10 am 
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    Marie decided it should be Wanda who gets the spell. She didn't Predict it, and she didn't even specify that Wanda should personally cast it (originally they were selling a caster to do it rather than Wanda)

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     Post Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 4:52 pm 
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    0beron wrote:
    Marie decided it should be Wanda who gets the spell. She didn't Predict it, and she didn't even specify that Wanda should personally cast it (originally they were selling a caster to do it rather than Wanda)
    I think that's all technically true, but a little misleading. Marie was certain that Wanda was the one who should be given the spell, which means that there was almost certainly a Prediction or two behind that decision. Making Predictions is what Marie is good at, so she probably makes a lot of them. And if there was a Prediction behind giving the spell to Wanda, then Marie must have known that the spell would end up being cast correctly somehow, so even if it seems unlikely that Wanda could cast the spell herself, it's not a matter of luck at that point. Whether Marie knew that Wanda would do the casting or not, Fate would have known and it wouldn't have let Marie make the Prediction if Wanda couldn't have cast the spell correctly.

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     Post Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:49 am 
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    this deteriorated fast at the beginning my to do list for parson:

    1: go to the short pier recruit person, croak him, decrypt him.
    2: repeat 1
    3: i now have 100 casters with no upkeep, use them to pwn everybody
    4: all de possible linkups
    5: many many stealth golems
    6: enough doll/change-mancy items to turn a lvl 1 into a god killing abomination
    7: set up golem relay to carry Stanely over to spacerock then back to gk
    8: sneak atk charlie to get more archons(even one would be nice to get new info on him)\
    9: mop up remaining jetstone ruler
    10: recapture captured archon to prevent intel from falling into enemy hands

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     Post Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 11:46 am 
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    conmor wrote:
    this deteriorated fast at the beginning my to do list for parson:

    1: go to the short pier recruit person, croak him, decrypt him.
    2: repeat 1
    3: i now have 100 casters with no upkeep, use them to pwn everybody
    4: all de possible linkups
    5: many many stealth golems
    6: enough doll/change-mancy items to turn a lvl 1 into a god killing abomination
    7: set up golem relay to carry Stanely over to spacerock then back to gk
    8: sneak atk charlie to get more archons(even one would be nice to get new info on him)\
    9: mop up remaining jetstone ruler
    10: recapture captured archon to prevent intel from falling into enemy hands

    Can I just say that I LOVE your step 1?

    While I think it likely neither Wanda, Jack nor Parson are aware of the short pier, this solution is a total win-win.
    Casters who go to the short pier are essentially looking for a last desperate piece of charity, and saving you into a complete upkeep-free state certainly is charity.
    Wanda would of course not bother asking the casters beforehand, but Parson might insist that only willing subjects be so converted.

    Given the lengths to which Rob has gone to give substance to the casters recruited into GK (e.g. Ace), I think it's unlikely he'll go this route, but I really WANT him to, as this is a perfectly Parsonish solution.

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     Post Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:21 pm 
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    Alpha the White wrote:
    Given the lengths to which Rob has gone to give substance to the casters recruited into GK (e.g. Ace), I think it's unlikely he'll go this route, but I really WANT him to, as this is a perfectly Parsonish solution.
    If it doesn't happen there will need to be a pretty good reason why it doesn't happen. I'm not sure it is actually a Parsonish solution. Parson has said that he wants to stop making enemies and start making friends, and that means spreading shmuckers around the Magic Kingdom and buying magic. People in the Magic Kingdom love that kind of thing. On the other hand, decrypting people could be seen as an act of war to the living people of the Magic Kingdom, and I don't think Parson likes killing people either.

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     Post Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:17 pm 
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    Lilwik wrote:
    If it doesn't happen there will need to be a pretty good reason why it doesn't happen. I'm not sure it is actually a Parsonish solution. Parson has said that he wants to stop making enemies and start making friends, and that means spreading shmuckers around the Magic Kingdom and buying magic. People in the Magic Kingdom love that kind of thing. On the other hand, decrypting people could be seen as an act of war to the living people of the Magic Kingdom, and I don't think Parson likes killing people either.

    Hence my point about only recruiting willing subjects.

    Recast decryption as salvation from upkeep, and to a group of barbarian casters for whom the demands of upkeep are a daily struggle, that might sound pretty dang good.

    Honestly, I'm not sure decryption is necessary to that equation, just understanding of the situation. Given the bleak situation Dove paints of a MK caster's plight, I'd wager there are a number of opportunities for an open-minded ruler in need of casters to recruit desperate casters, if they just knew of/had access to the short pier.

    It's always seemed odd to me that a tiny kingdom like FAQ would have so many casters without having conquered any sides (Haffaton excluded)...I wonder if Banhammer did just what I'm suggesting? Seems like something he'd do.

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     Post Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:21 pm 
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    Alpha the White wrote:
    It's always seemed odd to me that a tiny kingdom like FAQ would have so many casters without having conquered any sides (Haffaton excluded)...I wonder if Banhammer did just what I'm suggesting? Seems like something he'd do.


    The popping of Casters is at the will of the Titans. They clearly had an interest in what Banhammer was doing and gave him Casters accordingly.

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     Post Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 5:14 pm 
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    GWvsJohn wrote:
    Alpha the White wrote:
    It's always seemed odd to me that a tiny kingdom like FAQ would have so many casters without having conquered any sides (Haffaton excluded)...I wonder if Banhammer did just what I'm suggesting? Seems like something he'd do.


    The popping of Casters is at the will of the Titans. They clearly had an interest in what Banhammer was doing and gave him Casters accordingly.

    That or Banhammer took an interest in trading for casters from other sides or recruiting casters from the MK/Feral Barbarians.

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     Post Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2014 3:04 am 
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    wanda might not of spent much time around mk but sizemore has, and parson might ask him "where is a good place to recruit casters". answer: short pier. :geek: :ugeek: :geek: :ugeek: :geek: :ugeek:

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     Post Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2014 3:05 am 
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    oh and step one is also good way to level parson up. he needs the levels and croaking low-mid level caster would do it.

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