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 Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:30 pm 
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Round 1: Kingdom of Nawnia.
100 plus 82 equals 182 Schmuckers--1. Calculate Income from Cities
Upgrade Beaversdam for 30 Schmuckers--2. Build and Upgrade Cities
Pop 3 Infantry in White Witch's Castle--3. Create New Units
Pop Warlord named King Peter in Caer Paravel--3. Create New Units
Upkeep is 1+6+2=9x3=27 for infantry +10 for warlord=37--4. Pay Upkeep on Units

Move 2 Infantry from L2 to L4--5. Move Units
Move 1 Infantry from L2 to N3--5. Move Units
None--6. Resolve Combat (if any)
7. Post end of turn report

Final Report:
L4--Caer Paravel (Level 5): 3 Infantry; King Peter.
L2--White Witch's Castle (Level 3): 3 Infantry.
N3--Beaversdam (Level 3): 3 Infantry.
Scmuckers: 115.

END TURN


Last edited by Twoy on Sun Jul 04, 2010 3:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 5:42 pm 
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    Start Turn 1 ...

    Let's see how this flies-

    Income +100
    Treasury at start of turn 100.

    Pop 2 Infantry at Bwistol.
    Pop 3 Infantry at Wottewdam.
    Pop Economancer at Wome.

    Move 1 Infantry from Bwistol to Wome.
    Move 1 Infantry from Wottewdam to Wome.
    Move 1 Infantry from Wome to A9, build level 1 city: Pawis. (-10 Schmuckers)

    Upkeep: 11*3 + 10 => (-43)

    Turn report
    Schmuckers left: 47.

    Cities (Level, units):
    Wome (L5, 1 Economancer, 2 Infantry)
    Bwistol (L2, 4 Infantry)
    Wottewdam (L3, 4 Infantry)
    Pawis (L1, 1 Infantry)

    No free roaming units

    End Turn- how's that working out?

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:04 pm 
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    RE: Map is a cylinder - Yes, East to West, not North to South as in the last game. This way seems more appropriate.

    RE: Cerulean - Yes, I missed this. Crovius, can you please pick a different location for this city - as the later poster.

    RE: Starting Credits - remember, you pay upkeep in turn 0, so out of the 100 Schmuckers you earned, remove the maintenance of the starting units (usually 18 for 6 Infantry)

    RE: Building Cities - this happens before movement. So no one can build new cities in turn 1.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:12 pm 
    Has collected at least one unit Here for the 10th Anniversary
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    LT_Dave, does the Foolamancer bonus only apply to units that are in the hex where it starts the turn?

    If you guys don't mind, I'll hold off on moving till we get the errata sorted out.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:47 am 
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    LTDave wrote:
    RE: Starting Credits - remember, you pay upkeep in turn 0, so out of the 100 Schmuckers you earned, remove the maintenance of the starting units (usually 18 for 6 Infantry)

    So you start with 82 Schmuckers from Turn 0? Do you then add 100 Schmuckers at the beginnning of Turn 1? And subtract another 18 Schmuckers in Phase 4 of Turn 1?

    I think you have made the procedure more complicated than necessary by not following the procedures you outlined in the rules. Perhaps it would be better to strictly follow the procedure outlined in the rules.

    Turn Procedure
    1. Calculate Income from Cities
    2. Build and Upgrade Cities
    3. Create New Units
    4. Pay Upkeep on Units (if you can’t afford upkeep, remove units until you can)
    5. Move Units
    6. Resolve Combat (if any)
    7. Post end of turn report

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 5:38 am 
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    From Turn 0:

    Turn Procedure
    1. Calculate Income from Cities - 100

    2. Build and Upgrade Cities - None

    3. Create New Units - None

    4. Pay Upkeep on Units (if you can’t afford upkeep, remove units until you can)

    6 Garrison Units (-18)

    5. Move Units - None

    6. Resolve Combat (if any) - None

    7. Post end of turn report - Yes.

    Leaves you with 82 Schmuckers to start turn 1. Unless you started with 6 Flyers, in which case you have a lot less.

    Make sense?

    RE: Foolamancers - Yes, the bonus only works on units stacked with the Foolamancer at the beginning of the turn - ie, before movement.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:01 am 
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    LTDave wrote:
    Make sense?


    No.

    Because first step in turn 1 is calculating income, it means you then start step 2 with 182 schmuckers.

    Spoiler: show
    The weirdness, deliberate or not, is deeper. "Turn 0" supposedly is spent with no schmuckers, "but upkeep must be paid". HOW? A sorta logical conclusion is that you don't pay upkeep on fresh units, but you do pay for them next turn, which is how you can interpret the example in the rules. Turn 0, no money no upkeep. Turn 1 starts, you get your income from the cities and pay for the units you already have (standard procedure for TBSs, really). And you shouldn't be paying upkeep again.


    And I distinctly recall seeing that A1 was adjacent to A10 in one of the rules documents (though not the one currently online).

    EDIT:

    aaww, no new cities in turn 1? Ohwell, it's for the best, if we keep a E-W cylindrical map. Pawis was only safe on a N-S cylinder anyway.

    I'll wait for errata resolution before reposting orders. 'Cause really I need to know how mucho Schmuckero you get FOR turn 1.

    Suggestions:

    1) toroidal map. That will make everyone look twice at map borders.

    2) Either calculate upkeep at start of turn and DO NOT pay upkeep for freshly popped units that turn OR calculate upkeep just before combat.

    3) Calculate upkeep at END of turn. That'll encourage some offensiveness and Erfworld monstrosity :twisted:

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 1:15 pm 
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    Ok, Cerulean is now D1 and Indigo is now E2. Units stay in those cities.

    Have we worked out the steps for the turn cause I want to start with making more guys.

    Also, Herald's. I really like the one game we actually had a unit wth no combat ability that would travel to another city like a messenger. That was relly cool and added a level of roleplaying I found very refreshing.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 5:43 pm 
    This user posted the comment of the month Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
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    Kibitzing here....

    If I'm interpreting correctly, on turn 0 you can't do anything except pay upkeep -- can't pop new units, upgrade cities, move, get into combat, etc -- and post your turn report after. So at the end of turn 0, assuming your upkeep was 18, you'd have 82 shmuckers. Beginning of turn 1, you collect your 100 income, for a total of 182.

    Is that correct?

    Edit: Went back and looked at the rules (EERules 1 point 4.doc). At the end:

    Quote:
    Beginning the Game
    1. Indicate you want to play via this forum
    2. Choose an Empire Name, Leader Name, Colour, etc.
    3. Choose one of the starting locations (1 to 5) on the map for your capital.
    4. Choose a location for a level 3 and a level 2 City. They must be within two hexes of at least 1 other city of yours.
    5. Choose and deploy six units within your cities.
    THIS IS TURN 0.
    Cities and Units may not be built, nor cities upgraded this turn.
    Unit upkeep must be paid.
    Empires start with 0 schmuckers, but will earn 100 schmuckers at the start of the turn.


    The game starts with turn 0. On turn 1, then go through the phases in order.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 10:39 am 
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    I can imagine three possibilities:

    1. Earn income once and pay upkeep once. (This is what I did on my turn)
    2. Earn income once and pay upkeep twice.
    3. Earn income twice and pay upkeep twice.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:52 pm 
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    Players start turn 1 with 82 Schmuckers in the bank. They then earn 100 from their cities, and then pay upgrades for cities, create units, and then pay maintenance on units.

    The turn is order is as in the rules:

    1. Calculate Income from Cities
    2. Build and Upgrade Cities
    3. Create New Units
    4. Pay Upkeep on Units (if you can’t afford upkeep, remove units until you can)
    5. Move Units
    6. Resolve Combat (if any)
    7. Post end of turn report

    Things have to be in that order. So you can't pay upkeep, then create units, then move some, fight combat, then move some more. Just do as the steps says.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 2:25 am 
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    That's wonderful, but it means that-

    start turn 1 with 82 Schmuckers.

    1. Calculate income- 100.

    You now have 182 Schmuckers in the bank!

    (2. Upgrade all upgradeable cities, because you can)

    Which is a lot more than The Black Hand and Twoy thought they had, and they may want to adjust (redo) their turns because of that.

    Incidentally, I notice The Black Hand didn't pay upkeep on his turn. Sneeky :twisted:

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:35 pm 
    Has collected at least one unit Here for the 10th Anniversary
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    If you guys don't mind, I'll wait for Twoy and the Black Hand to correct their turns before doing mine.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:39 pm 
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    BLANDCorporatio wrote:
    Incidentally, I notice The Black Hand didn't pay upkeep on his turn. Sneeky :twisted:


    Yeep, I though that had already been done (hence why I was calculating from 82 Schmuckers and not 182. My mistake :oops: )

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 3:17 pm 
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    I modified my turn. No need for a dirtamancer now that I'm rich.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 3:56 am 
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    Ok, so Twoy and The Black Hand have modified their turn to reflect starting cash.

    Bland - you need to modify for starting cash and no new builds on turn 1.

    Then we are right to continue...

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:14 am 
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    Before I repost, I have a question about combat, and cities.

    "The side that inflicts the most hits is the victor". How does that mesh with "a city level is its defense bonus, which multiplies the number of units in the city when choosing casualties"?

    Say, I have 1 unit in Wome. This unit gets attacked by a stack of 5 units; no mancy no nothing, the 5 units roll well and do 2/3 of their number in damage (about 3) while the Woman unit does 1/3 of 1 (0). Now,

    a) the 3 damage, being insufficient to actually croak the Woman unit, does not count as a hit, instead counts as 0, defender wins.
    b) the 3 damage gets divided by 5, the defense bonus, and rounds to the nearest integer (1) which croaks the defending unit. Attacker wins.
    c) the 3 damage is insufficient to croak the defending unit, but nonetheless 3 > 0, so attacker wins.

    Or in other words, the options are:

    a) when deciding a victor in a battle, don't compare the damage dealt but the units actually croaked by the two sides.
    b) use a defense value to dampen the damage dealt by an attacker, use that as a basis to see how many casualties the defender took and decide who won.
    c) compare damage dealt by attacker and defender to decide who won.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 9:18 pm 
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    Bland, have a look at the spreadsheet and the combat tab. This should answer your question.

    But,

    The one unit in Wome (level 5) counts as 5 units when inflicting casualties on the attackers.

    So if 5 units attack your 1 unit in the level 5 city, both count as having 5 units. One will inflict 2/3 of 5, 3, the other will inflict 1/3 of 5, 2.

    Each unit only takes one hit to destroy, regardless of the level of the city.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 3:43 am 
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    Okey dokey then.

    Did notice that the combat sheet has columns H..K thoughtfully collapsed together. Not vewy nice, twuly not vewy nice, but possible to disentangle.

    Turn:

    1. Income: +100 for 182 Schmuckers.
    2. Build and upgrade: Upgrade Wottewdam (-40) and Bwistol (-30).
    3. Pop units: pop 5 infantry at Wome
    4. Pay upkeep: 11*3 = 33.
    5. Move units: Move 3 Infantry from Wome to A9.
    6. Combat: none.
    7: End turn report:

    Treasury: 182 - 40 - 30 - 33 = 182 - 103 = 79Schmuckers.
    Wome: Level 5, 3 Infantry.
    Wottewdam: Level 4, 2 Infantry.
    Bwistol: Level 3, 3 Infantry.
    A9: 3 Infantry.

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     Post subject: Re: Erfworld Empires
     Post Posted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 10:13 am 
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    So... can I post my first turn yet? I want to make sure ya'll have made all the correct changes you need first. And has someone updated the map to show I moved my cities?

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