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 Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 10:14 am 
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Interesting that Wanda is not attacking with the bulk of decrypted forces and is using the dwagons instead. Yes, there are decrypted in the stack, but the vast majority of the nondecrypted forces are marching off to a meat grinder battle (Jack may be the only nondecrypted unit left in the main stack now).

Prediction...
1) Most Dwagons die in the coming assault/ambush/trap/whatever and are decrypted.
2) Jillian + hidden caster (turnamancer?) flip Wanda's loyalty back to FAQ.
3) All decrypted flip to FAQs alignment with Wanda
4) Assassination attempt shortly after in GK (probably by masses of decrypted Hobgobwins hiding under GK)
5) GK is forced to ally with nondecrypted royal sides.
6) Zombie apocalypse.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 10:19 am 
    E is for Erfworld Supporter Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
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    On the hiring thing. There could be a specific hiring mechanic. This would explain how Charlie can rent out his archons to 2 sides in the same conflict (or have them attack his own units).

    If you loan a unit, then they become part of the new side for the purposes of determining turn order. This could also mean that any items/units created by the unit are property of the side they are working for. It might also have an effect on loyalty (perhaps they show loyalty to the new side) and they are presumably not subject to being disbanded by their temporary Ruler.

    Barbarians might decide to use this mechanic when looking for work, as then their temporary side would pay their upkeep as if they were part of the side. However, allied sides presumably handle their own upkeep.

    SteveMB wrote:
    Lord Kasavin wrote:
    P.S. Forming a new side appears to be limited to royalty.

    Hmmm... if that's so (and Erflings know that it's so), then exterminating royalty might be a natural complement to a plan to conquer the whole world (and make the conquest stick indefinitely)....


    Apparently, barbarian warlords pop in the wild. If they capture a city, then that also forms a new side.

    However, if GK was the only side in the world, then it should have little problem handling barbarians.

    Perhaps, the game is set up so that barbarians pop at a faster rate the larger the side is. The pop rate for barbarians would be very high in the "city radius" of cities that belong to a massive side.

    There is presumably some mechanic that prevented a single side ruling the world up to this point.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 10:23 am 
    E is for Erfworld Supporter Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
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    Kizmet wrote:
    Interesting that Wanda is not attacking with the bulk of decrypted forces and is using the dwagons instead. Yes, there are decrypted in the stack, but the vast majority of the nondecrypted forces are marching off to a meat grinder battle (Jack may be the only nondecrypted unit left in the main stack now).

    Prediction...
    1) Most Dwagons die in the coming assault/ambush/trap/whatever and are decrypted.
    2) Jillian + hidden caster (turnamancer?) flip Wanda's loyalty back to FAQ.
    3) All decrypted flip to FAQs alignment with Wanda


    It is unclear how fast that would be. Wanda doesn't personally have thinkamancy, so they wouldn't know immediately. OTOH, archons could be used to inform the decrypted at GK.

    What might happen is that the loyalty score of the decrypted drops to minimum, but they remain GK units. Thus, they have to obey Stanley, but they would turn to Wanda's new side very easily.

    Also, it is unclear if they are loyal to Wanda or the pliers. If Wanda loses the pliers, she may find that Ansom stops calling her mistress and starts treating her like any other caster.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 10:53 am 
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    raphfrk wrote:
    Also, it is unclear if they are loyal to Wanda or the pliers. If Wanda loses the pliers, she may find that Ansom stops calling her mistress and starts treating her like any other caster.
    It is unclear if an attuned user even can lose them. The game might simply not have mechanics for it -- the pliers might simply be part of her stats now. We've never seen Stanley without the Arkenhammer, say.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:00 am 
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    Lord Kasavin wrote:
    P.S. Forming a new side appears to be limited to royalty.

    So Stanley is royalty, it's all a misunderstanding, and Gobwin Knob gets to join the RCC2 against Charlie. :P

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:08 am 
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    E is for Erfworld Supporter Print Book 2 & Draw Book 3 Supporter This user is a Tool! This user was a Tool before it was cool Pin-up Calendar and New Art Team Supporter Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit Erfworld Bicycle® Playing Cards supporter
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    raphfrk wrote:
    Also, if she is a mercenary, then it is unclear who the decrypted actually belong to. When allied with a side, presumably that side will cover upkeep. If that is the case, then if Wanda breaks alliance, then she would have to cover the upkeep for the decrypted army from her purse, which would likely be impossible.


    Err, I might massively have misinterpreted panel 2 in this comic, but I thought Decrypted had zero upkeep?

    (Admittedly this makes for the somewhat frightening notion that if Wanda ever in any way changes Sides, she will bring her whole Decrypted army with her free of charge...)

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:13 am 
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    And I am now reminded of why I hate Stanley, also - mark off that point I gave him for giving the no-go on decrypting Jack.

    The Old Hack wrote:

    (Admittedly this makes for the somewhat frightening notion that if Wanda ever in any way changes Sides, she will bring her whole Decrypted army with her free of charge...)


    They may br free of charge but waging a war is not, they still needed the schmuckers to pay for the cities they had captured.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:18 am 
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    We've never seen any evidence that cities cost money, in fact we've seen more that they make it.

    raphfrk wrote:
    Also, if she is a mercenary, then it is unclear who the decrypted actually belong to. When allied with a side, presumably that side will cover upkeep. If that is the case, then if Wanda breaks alliance, then she would have to cover the upkeep for the decrypted army from her purse, which would likely be impossible.


    Wanda is not a mercenary. She is a unit of Gobwin Knob.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:51 am 
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    She might need Ansom's bonuses.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:00 pm 
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    If stanley gave an order all units must obey him. If they dont have too wanda wasnt be so mad about ansom's act. And i think he can disband wanda as well as other units. she still scares from this possibilty. so she dont want to make him mad.
    i think they are going to destroy the towers but cant keep the city for many turns. something will happen and parson will gain control of the army again. lets wait for new updates.
    btw happy new year to everyone. :)

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:01 pm 
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    Wait, are they trying to take the city or are they just going to croak Slately and Jillian and then run?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:03 pm 
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    Great update. I feel for Ansom now, he's quickly turning into my favorite character. I hated him in book 1. And if not now, then by the end of the book he is sooo going to turn. Wanda shouldn't treat her warlords like dirt.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:03 pm 
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    They have to take it.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:08 pm 
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    Croak Slately and Jillian, then hope that works.

    Personally, I suspect that Tramminis is already heir, having immediately become heir when his brother died. He is clearly royalty, and there might be a succession protocol if only non-heir royals are left alive.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:16 pm 
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    mhangman wrote:
    They have to take it.


    Agreed. Based on what we know it would appear that killing Slately isn't enough to prevent Jetstone's forces from reforming as a side. There's also good reason to believe that if the capital isn't taken, Tramenis will be able to reform the side on his turn. Assuming that he isn't already the next heir by default now that Ossomer is gone.

    As for Stanley disbanding Wanda, I don't believe casters play by the same rules. Leaders can hire or dismiss casters, but I don't believe they get disbanded like other units. If they're dismissed they can always go to the Magic Kingdom.

    Wanda isn't welcome in the Magic Kingdom any longer but she also has enough forces to form her own side at this point. Forces that may not require a capital city to remain in existence?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:20 pm 
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    ARGHH, i was somehow tolerant of Stanley, but right now i think he must be killed, fast... He is obnoxiously stupid, but i realize that he is a great character because inspires so much passion (hatred, contempt) from the readers. That been said I still want him dead.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:32 pm 
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    WHAT?!?!?!? I LOVE STANLEY, HE'S HILARIOUS! He'll never get killed off, he's the comic relief.

    Menas wrote:
    mhangman wrote:
    They have to take it.


    Agreed. Based on what we know it would appear that killing Slately isn't enough to prevent Jetstone's forces from reforming as a side. There's also good reason to believe that if the capital isn't taken, Tramenis will be able to reform the side on his turn. Assuming that he isn't already the next heir by default now that Ossomer is gone.

    As for Stanley disbanding Wanda, I don't believe casters play by the same rules. Leaders can hire or dismiss casters, but I don't believe they get disbanded like other units. If they're dismissed they can always go to the Magic Kingdom.

    Wanda isn't welcome in the Magic Kingdom any longer but she also has enough forces to form her own side at this point. Forces that may not require a capital city to remain in existence?


    Or she could just take Spacerock or maybe Unaroyal as her capital.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:43 pm 
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    My understanding is that Wanda's upkeep is paid by Stanley. She is a GK unit, susceptible to disbanding by GK's ruler (for now.) also: Slately is so into 'royalty' that he popped 3 heirs, Tramennis became official heir as soon as Ossomer croaked.

    As far as barbarianism goes, I think it just means that you do not have a ruler or a treasury. Either you're a barbarian, responsible for your own upkeep, or you're not. I don't think casters are exempt from this at all. If your ruler goes, you no longer have access to a treasury. If all of your cities go, again, no treasury. Anybody can create a new Side, all you need are Schmuckers and a place to build your city. most of the best city sites have probably been taken for a long time now (especially in densely populated areas like the area around GK.)

    I think that very soon now, Wanda will turn and name one of the newly conquered cities as her new capital. GK will be surrounded by a new Side set to swallow them up. This disaster in the making may or may not be purposeful on Wanda's part depending on whether she can decrypt in the middle of battle or anly afterwards.

    I could imagine Ansom gaining independence with distance, this internal struggle of his is too rich with potential drama to ignore.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:52 pm 
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    I can't see any of the attuned Tools being croaked. I think that Stanley really is like a hammer, blunt and with only one purpose: to smash things. He's perfectly suited to it.

    Similarly Wanda is like a set of pliers. She grabs things and twists them. She grasps tightly and she manipulates.

    I have to think more about the nature of a dish, but what I've got so far is that it makes things more convenient. There's something about 'service' that I can't wrap my thoughts around as well. It spreads things out and yet provides a container for them so that you can see everything at once... it keeps things cleaner than they might be directly in your hands or on some other surface.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 14
     Post Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:02 pm 
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    Kosher Tigger wrote:
    My understanding is that Wanda's upkeep is paid by Stanley. She is a GK unit, susceptible to disbanding by GK's ruler (for now.) also: Slately is so into 'royalty' that he popped 3 heirs, Tramennis became official heir as soon as Ossomer croaked.

    As far as barbarianism goes, I think it just means that you do not have a ruler or a treasury. Either you're a barbarian, responsible for your own upkeep, or you're not. I don't think casters are exempt from this at all. If your ruler goes, you no longer have access to a treasury. If all of your cities go, again, no treasury. Anybody can create a new Side, all you need are Schmuckers and a place to build your city. most of the best city sites have probably been taken for a long time now (especially in densely populated areas like the area around GK.)

    I think that very soon now, Wanda will turn and name one of the newly conquered cities as her new capital. GK will be surrounded by a new Side set to swallow them up. This disaster in the making may or may not be purposeful on Wanda's part depending on whether she can decrypt in the middle of battle or anly afterwards.

    I could imagine Ansom gaining independence with distance, this internal struggle of his is too rich with potential drama to ignore.


    Well, decrypted forces require no upkeep so Wanda would only be responsible for her own. So she wouldn't necessarily have need for a treasury if all of her forces were decrypted.

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