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 Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
 Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:39 am 
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There wouldn't be a backlash from the magic kingdom, there would be a backlash against them, for having this gaping security hole. Whether they become militant is something we can't guess without knowing the nature of their organization. Everything we've seen so far indicates that individual casters still obey the orders of the side that pops them, and the MK is more of a vacation spot than an organized faction.

My instinct tells me that this is simply something that no one has thought of yet, like everything other tactic Parson uses, and it will be copied immediately after it succeeds, necessitating the shutdown of the MK's open portal policy.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:53 am 
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    You know, with all this talk of using portals to attack, well, I think I am going to have to demand some Companion Cube references and a declaration from Tramennis that the cake is a lie.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:19 am 
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    Sieggy wrote:
    We've ignored another piece of foreshadowing in this discussion so far - Janis and the unnamed Predictamancer. I think that both of them will be waiting for Parson as he makes his subterranean dash, not to stop him, but to give him whatever oracular insights / warnings / Revelations of Destiny that Plotamancy demands. Janis & the caster should be arriving back at the bridge to find Sizemore missing about the time he gets back to GK.


    Since Janis went to the Predictamancer to specifically ask about the upcoming battle, it's probably a given that they'll know what Parson is planning.

    Janis in fact might be able to help Parson's plan succeed by diverting anyone who might discover it while in action (causing people to flake is a hippiemancer power). The question remains though of whether or not she is willing to openly aid him.

    In terms of the plot line, I doubt that the entire MK will turn against GK, nor do I see them allying with GK. Most likely scenario is that Parson's little excursion will be hidden and kept secret so the MK neutrality won't be affected.
    ---

    This discussion about Parson eventually seeing and recognizing the jetpack convinces me even more that Parson is capable of Signamancy, even without spending any juice. Recognizing what an object does by the way it looks is something that he does without thought, but would probably require another caster to use signamancy.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:27 am 
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    Scaramouche wrote:
    You know, with all this talk of using portals to attack, well, I think I am going to have to demand some Companion Cube references and a declaration from Tramennis that the cake is a lie.


    :lol:

    Mick715 wrote:
    And yes yes...we can talk about the practical limitations of a jetpack... or talk about it being a freaking awesome jetpack!


    Oh dont get me wrong. Jetpacks have always been awesome things in every game that features them. Im glad to see this included in Erfworld.. just.. yeah. Ace is stupid.

    Hopefully his repeated brushoffs will drop his loyalty, and Parson can take him back to GK :) I looove trinkets :D

    I'm also starting to like Cubbins too, which is weird, since we haven't seen much of him.. I hope he lives.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:44 am 
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    So it appears that Parson has substituted the Sword of petulance for the old sword of ruthlessness

    Why should he have respect for TMK's rules? Well, apart from the fact that he and the two people he is talking to own their continued existence to the same TMK, and Maggie and Sizemore would be croaked or vegetables if the casters hadn't undone the link HE commanded, no reason at all.

    He so seriously needs to be Batch-slipped for that - and I hope Janice does it to him.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:04 am 
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    cdrcjsn wrote:
    Since Janis went to the Predictamancer to specifically ask about the upcoming battle, it's probably a given that they'll know what Parson is planning.


    but predictamancers can only give a vague sense of the future and not anything detailed (Wanda thought Stanley'd die and she'd end up the with the arkenhammer). If predictamancers could give that kind of precision no side without one would continue to exist.

    Diss Champ wrote:
    I suspect Tram is going to deeply regret not putting on that jetpack when he had the chance.


    is anyone else thinking that this is a "Slately's bad influence" thing? I can imagine if Tramennis was walking on his own to the parley, he could've spared a few minutes for Ace to show it to him and who knows, even wear it (then again, fashion sense-wise....).

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:13 am 
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    Predicamancy could still clue Janis in. With Wanda, it was 'Stanley + You = You get a tool!' and she choose to interpret that in a certain way. Janis may learn that 'Parson + Portals = Win' - doesn't really explain why that makes sense, but she knows she might want to hang around portal park and watch what happens.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:54 am 
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    build6 wrote:

    is anyone else thinking that this is a "Slately's bad influence" thing? I can imagine if Tramennis was walking on his own to the parley, he could've spared a few minutes for Ace to show it to him and who knows, even wear it (then again, fashion sense-wise....).


    I think the bad influence thing is far too understated. You have a caster who is making TONS of magic items, and you refuse to use them? Yes it may not be as immediately practical as say a cloth golem, but it has long term uses that can help turn the tide (and make your warlords more effective)

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:21 pm 
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    Predictimancy:
    Four big events remaining...

    1) Stanley is a dead man walking. Probably to natural allies turning and swarming (after Parson leaves GK through the portal).

    2) Wanda is going to be her own side. Probably through Ossomer as heir/vassal via decryption. Slately will die first during the upcoming battle.

    3) Parson is going to be a barbarian after Stanley dies. Probably through another technicality of his warlord/caster hybrid nature in erfworld. It is definately time for the player to start making his own decisions in this game.

    4) Casters *cannot* be decrypted. Decrypted *can* pass through the portals into the MK. Sets up a war against magic. The masses vs the powerful few.

    These events set up book 3... World War Wanda.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:43 pm 
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    I don't think there will be a fall-related death for the Jetstone royalty. Ansom already died that way, after all. I also don't think Ace will join GK, simply because it would be too powerful a tool to give to Parson.

    My pet theory? I think the jetpack has been introduced here to allow Trem to escape when things go south - Ace will zoom in and scoop him up and fly them both out of the zone to safety. That way the story gets to keep Trem and Ace as a nice team to play against Parson.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:57 pm 
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    gazes_also wrote:
    So it appears that Parson has substituted the Sword of petulance for the old sword of ruthlessness

    Why should he have respect for TMK's rules? Well, apart from the fact that he and the two people he is talking to own their continued existence to the same TMK, and Maggie and Sizemore would be croaked or vegetables if the casters hadn't undone the link HE commanded, no reason at all.

    He so seriously needs to be Batch-slipped for that - and I hope Janice does it to him.

    Disagreed; gratitude does not ask for obedience. Having at one point benefited from one part of a rough collection of rules, mechanics and/or people does not invalidate critique of everything fitting under the same label - and in fact that kind of thinking is one of humanity's worse habits, resulting in a lot of pointless and detrimental formalities getting entrenched alongside any culture's more useful lessons. If you can't pick a system apart and oust the bad out of generalized 'respect' for the good you end up keeping the bathwater with every baby.

    'Sides, the first of those things is thanks to the MK's mechanics (likely titan-designed) rather than its populace, while the second is only dubiously true and quite possibly not known to Parson.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:10 pm 
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    I feel like the answer to Parson's plan is just out of reach... like we should probably be able to figure out the plan if we reconcile all of the mismatched observations we've pulled together:

    1. Food fight,
    2. Works better during a Parley,
    3. Works better with all of the forces assembled over the garrison,
    4. Someone needs more time for something (Parson to get in place and get Sizemore on the same page? Wanda for some reason? Jack to convincingly pretend to stop using foolmancy? Troops in GK to mass-butcher the edible troops in prep for transport?),
    5. The yellow dwagons are put in front... with the archons,
    6. Cheat,
    7. Might not work,
    8. Doesn't necessarily require Parson to go through the portals, or else Maggie wouldn't have be surprised after Parson's talk with Wanda.

    Independent of the plan, storytelling conventions also suggest that:

    1. Tram will need a Jetpack... weirdly, Slately's brush off of Ace was possibly a lucky move given that GK needs more time (unless they need more time during Parley),
    2. Don will finally quash, or be brought down by, unrest,
    3. The glass ceiling will be shattered... hmm, this should be done by a woman or a minority, I suppose... OR, more appropriate for Erfworld, a regular unit that will subsequently get promoted to warlord,
    4. Someone will fall and falling mechanics will be relevant,
    5. Charlescomm's "significant forces in the battlespace" will come into play,
    6. Jillian's forces will either come back to affect things or her decision to not come back will have been what doomed JS.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:41 pm 
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    effataigus wrote:
    I feel like the answer to Parson's plan is just out of reach... like we should probably be able to figure out the plan if we reconcile all of the mismatched observations we've pulled together:

    1. Food fight,
    2. Works better during a Parley,
    3. Works better with all of the forces assembled over the garrison,
    4. Someone needs more time for something (Parson to get in place and get Sizemore on the same page? Wanda for some reason? Jack to convincingly pretend to stop using foolmancy? Troops in GK to mass-butcher the edible troops in prep for transport?),
    5. The yellow dwagons are put in front... with the archons,
    6. Cheat,
    7. Might not work,
    8. Doesn't necessarily require Parson to go through the portals, or else Maggie wouldn't have be surprised after Parson's talk with Wanda.


    9. Title of Issue 2 of Book 2, "It's Raining Men"

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:52 pm 
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    Trost wrote:
    The Black Hand wrote:
    So, something like Colonel Hammer's Regiment from the Hammer's Slammers books, then?

    I could see that . . . though i suspect Charlescomm would need some kind of heavily-armored, semi-flying unit with a ranged Shockamancy attack if they were to go the Slammer route.


    heck, Ace would probably be able to upgrade siege into actual TANKS. Actually, I noticed the GK forces have lots of references to hardware... Ace Hardware being a tool store... He kind of has to turn to GK. (I hope it's to Parson, not Decryption.)

    Knowing how clever Charlie and Parson are, they'd figure out how to produce Gunships.


    Well, the "heavily-armored, semi-flying units" I was talking about were a nod to the supertanks used by the Slammers: air-cushion vehicles that could go anywhere, take direct hits from some pretty powerful weapons (and survive), and were capable of obliterating hostiles with plasma-based weaponry.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:52 pm 
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    coyo wrote:
    Rizban wrote:
    On first glance, it looked like Slately was facepalming in the last panel. On closer inspection, he was merely stroking his beard...


    I got that, too.


    Funny thing is that I got the exact opposite impression. I thought he was stroking his beard in the manner to show he was thoughtfully considering whether what Tram said was true or not (complete with an unconvinced furrowing of the brows), and then realized it was much more likely to be a "this thing is itchy" type of beard stroke.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 2:11 pm 
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    I find it amusing that Ace shows up in a comic exactly one update after someone had declared we'd never meet him.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:40 pm 
    E is for Erfworld Supporter This user was a Tool before it was cool This user is a Tool! Here for the 10th Anniversary Has collected at least one unit
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    effataigus wrote:
    I feel like the answer to Parson's plan is just out of reach... like we should probably be able to figure out the plan if we reconcile all of the mismatched observations we've pulled together:

    1. Food fight,
    2. Works better during a Parley,
    3. Works better with all of the forces assembled over the garrison,
    4. Someone needs more time for something (Parson to get in place and get Sizemore on the same page? Wanda for some reason? Jack to convincingly pretend to stop using foolmancy? Troops in GK to mass-butcher the edible troops in prep for transport?),
    5. The yellow dwagons are put in front... with the archons,
    6. Cheat,
    7. Might not work,
    8. Doesn't necessarily require Parson to go through the portals, or else Maggie wouldn't have be surprised after Parson's talk with Wanda.


    Hm. Well... how long does a parley last? And do Erfworld units get hungry on a turn basis or a time basis. Wanda's units (largely) have no upkeep, recall.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:15 pm 
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    Raza wrote:
    [

    'Sides, the first of those things is thanks to the MK's mechanics (likely titan-designed) rather than its populace, while the second is only dubiously true and quite possibly not known to Parson.


    Nope. Parson survived the "mechanics" unharmed, the populace were undecided, tending towards "if in doubt, croak it" until Janice intervened and directly saved him. The second is absolutely true and definitely known to Parson as the unravelling of the link took place while he was in TMK.

    Yes, there are those who have not time for the social niceties that make no sense to them - they are call obnoxious boors and you wouldn't want to eat lunch next to one.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:18 pm 
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    cdrcjsn wrote:
    Janis in fact might be able to help Parson's plan succeed by diverting anyone who might discover it while in action (causing people to flake is a hippiemancer power).


    Imagine the look on his face if he gets all psyched up again, then emerges from the portal into a cloud of funky smoke.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 46
     Post Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:16 pm 
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    gazes_also wrote:
    Nope. Parson survived the "mechanics" unharmed, the populace were undecided, tending towards "if in doubt, croak it" until Janice intervened and directly saved him.

    Yeah, that's the point. The erfworld game mechanics allowed him to escape the volcano. The people that happened to live around this natural phenomenon merely stood there and considered killing him, then reluctantly decided not to. That is hardly something to be grateful for, since they posed the that threat to begin with. If I put a knife to your throat, then let you go again, does that mean you henceforth owe me respect and obedience?

    gazes_also wrote:
    The second is absolutely true and definitely known to Parson as the unravelling of the link took place while he was in TMK.

    Nonsense. Casters only have a chance of suffering death or damage from a link being abruptly broken - so far, only one out of six examples suffered permanent damage. And Parson was unconscious in TMK while the link was unravelled.

    gazes_also wrote:
    Yes, there are those who have not time for the social niceties that make no sense to them - they are call obnoxious boors and you wouldn't want to eat lunch next to one.

    Then you'll have to take your lunch somewhere else. =P

    Honestly, doing things that don't make sense to you is just stupid, any way you spin it. Terms like 'obnoxious', 'boorish' and 'rude' don't really mean anything ethically, they're just pretentious and derogatory ways of saying you don't like something. I say judging people on etiquette you can't make sense of makes you the unpleasant one, even if you're in the majority.

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