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 Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:46 pm 
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Good one but Im not certain that Wanda will not still turn or something similarly "game" changing, what if Jillian croaks her? The tricky part about guiding yourself by Fate and Predictamancy is that you do not know what is going to happen it is all up to the Titan's will. Misconceptions are a part of that as well. I do agree the Titans are doing a great job on this particular story arc tho.
Also If Jillian popped a Turnamancer now of all times that means the Titans intend for her to use this turnamancer. Jillian is not going to be defeated and she will not leave peacefully, she will also not join GK. She can turn Jack still. Jack even loves her and is from FAQ originally.

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Last edited by Salvage on Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:50 pm 
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    BCCroaker wrote:
    Jillian has her sword ready, and after Wanda's words, I'll take a wild guess she's going to use it to try to knock the pliers out of Wanda's hand.

    It looked to me like she reached for her sword after Wanda brandished the Arkenpliers in her general direction -- Wanda apparently meant it simply as an emphatic gesture, but simple reflex would lead an experienced warlord to get ready to defend herself.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:53 pm 
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    Nargrakhan wrote:
    Hm... I wonder how Charlie fits in Wanda's plans...


    Probably the phrase "curb stomping" fits in there somewhere.


    Spot wrote:
    Ansan Gotti wrote:
    I think the info Jillian let on is more important tactically right now. But the info Wanda let on is more important strategically, down the road. Charlie was already acting against GK's interests, but it will truly be implacable if he knows Wanda's ultimate goal is to seize the Arkendish.



    But Charlie is attuned to the Arkendish, so the primary goal is not to seize it, but to bring him on board. Presumably, disposing of Charlie ad finding a new person to attune to the dish would be a fallback position, if Charlie refuses to join when the time comes.



    Hmm, good point. I wonder if a decrypted would still be able able to attune to a tool. That would be one way to attune all the Arkentools under one will.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:56 pm 
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    Quote:
    Charlie was already acting against GK's interests, but it will truly be implacable if he knows Wanda's ultimate goal is to seize the Arkendish.

    Why do you think she plans to take the Arkendish away from Charlie? He's attuned to it and therefore, according to Wanda's logic, he's one of the Chosen of the Titans. I think she wants to gather both the Tools and their attuned wielders. If her plan was just to gather all the Arkentools under her personal control, I think she would have simply croaked Stanley by now and taken the Hammer for herself.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:10 pm 
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    Spot wrote:
    But Charlie is attuned to the Arkendish, so the primary goal is not to seize it, but to bring him on board. Presumably, disposing of Charlie ad finding a new person to attune to the dish would be a fallback position, if Charlie refuses to join when the time comes.


    My gut tells me that being in the same alliance is not enough, that it would need to be on the same side. So unless there's a mechanism for one overlord to submit to another, I think Stanley is on his quest come hell or high water. With Wanda confirming in the strongest possible language.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:16 pm 
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    I think most of what will happen is clear. Jillian made a great miscalculation, thinking her turnamancer would be able to put Wanda on team good. Even with all the plans they had made in case that didn't work, it was still a great part of their strategy. I bet Charlie will help, in the fight, and it could still mean Wanda will loose more than she will gain, and this will likely end in a huge blunder for all parties involved, specially the king of Jetstone.

    If they can't get wanda, next best would be to try get the Turnamancer to affect her loyalty, or even the decrypted's. If decrypted actually HAVE any loyalty then manipulating decrepted warlords could be a good way to defeat them. Because the moment their loyalty to Gobwin Knob drops, they could remember their previous life and want to kill Stanley.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:20 pm 
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    Well, we have no idea of what's involved in Attunement. Its the great unknown. If Wanda thought for one moment that she'd attune to the Hammer, she would have croaked Stanley (in fact, she tried to). The First Battle of Faq convinced her that Stanley was meant to hold the hammer, and the rest she'd have to figure out.

    Wanda seems to have decent instincts when it comes to Charlie. No doubt she expects him to turn when he realizes that's his best bet.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:23 pm 
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    Knight13 wrote:
    Why do you think she plans to take the Arkendish away from Charlie? He's attuned to it and therefore, according to Wanda's logic, he's one of the Chosen of the Titans. I think she wants to gather both the Tools and their attuned wielders. If her plan was just to gather all the Arkentools under her personal control, I think she would have simply croaked Stanley by now and taken the Hammer for herself.


    Stanley is more than willing to work with Wanda. Charlie isn't. For now he's somewhat safe unside his super fortress, but eventualy Wanda and her mega decrypted army will be knocking at his door. And then Charlie gets to choose between making a full alliance, instead of the twisted contracts he does, or we get to discover what if a decrypted person can still be attuned to an arkentool.

    Unless Wanda is stopped. Wich would really explain why Charlie wants to take her down so badly. Perhaps he already realized that sooner or later he would receive a proposition he can't refuse. And Charlie isn't exactly the kind of person who likes taking orders.

    The most ironic thing is that the royals were kinda right after all. This is a war of the tools!

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:26 pm 
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    If Wanda defeats the coalition today, then Charlie joining Gobwin Knob could become a likely scenario... Charlie may be philantropic (Lets face it, much of his involvment up to now hasn't been really worth his schmuckers and pretty self-destructive even if he claims it's all about profits) when it doesn't involve his survival, and defending his view of Erfworld, but i don't think that will hold for too long should a real threat to his continued existence come to happen. And if he did join, he would have a much better chance at undermining Gobwin Knob from the inside.

    The only problem is Stanley doesn't like Charlie.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:29 pm 
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    theseus2x wrote:
    Wanda seems to have decent instincts when it comes to Charlie. No doubt she expects him to turn when he realizes that's his best bet.


    oslecamo2 wrote:
    Stanley is more than willing to work with Wanda. Charlie isn't. For now he's somewhat safe unside his super fortress, but eventualy Wanda and her mega decrypted army will be knocking at his door.


    Even if Wanda doesn't attack Charlie directly, she can in effect starve him out by conquering more and more of his potential customers into one unified side.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:35 pm 
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    Ambug666 wrote:
    Croak Stanly and see if the Arkenhammer can attune to someone else. Let's say... Jillian.

    Maybe it is incredibly rare for someone to attune to a tool? Maybe the people who are attuned know the tools need to be together. Remember Stanley did say that Ansom was bringing the Pliers to him...


    It was Wanda who convinced him to mount the quest for the Arkentools. He probably would not have even thought of it by himself, but Wanda knew she was entitled to one and found this to be a better way of getting it than sitting around and waiting. I have always suspected her of being behind the assassination of King Saline IV in order to put a more amenable figure on the throne.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:50 pm 
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    I'm curious to see how this plays out. The apparent outcome is that GK will capture Spacerock, decrypt the FAQ and garrison forces, and have the outside Jetstone forces disband. This will allow them to bring in Ansom's forces into Spacerock and withstand any attack by the Haggar force. However, this raises plot issues in that GK could become too powerful. Thus, there is a sort of paradox in that GK losing is not very plausible but GK winning is also not very plausible due to plot.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:53 pm 
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    Is it me, or... the heads are getting bigger?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:56 pm 
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    Aha! More evidence that there may have been more to Wanda's prediction in FAQ. I wonder if Hippiemancer Janis is following the same or a separate/parallel prediction.

    As has already been mentioned, it does bring more thought to how Charlie's role in this will play out. Stanley really disklikes Charlie and I really don't think those two will play well together especially if Jillian's big suprise tips everyone to the degree of Charlie's heretofore discreet involvement in the upcoming upset. Wanda probably knows that 'the arkentools will be brought together' but not much more than that and is just following Fate. Its worked so far so why stop now, right?

    My own predictamancy: Someone on the GK side will die or be defeated/captured/turned regardless. Jillian will stay alive somehow. She still has too big a part to play unless she is decrypted but whats the fun in that for Wanda. Something major has to happen in the next three page updates unless the author can draw out the parley that much longer or with flashbacks to GK or (crossing fingers) Charlie's capital.

    I believe that over the course of Book 2 we will see Caesar splitting from Transylvito and joining some other faction (GK?) which allows the possibility of a fanservice battle between Vinnie and Caesar. I also see more representation of the natural allies and their importance. Do they not clamor for their own city to control rather than just serving other sides? I also predict that we will see the introduction of a snarky/smarmy piker called P. Armour who gets repeatedly proven wrong but refuses to accept it.


    Last edited by joosy on Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:40 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:57 pm 
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    Ambug666 wrote:
    Croak Stanly and see if the Arkenhammer can attune to someone else. Let's say... Jillian.

    Maybe it is incredibly rare for someone to attune to a tool? Maybe the people who are attuned know the tools need to be together. Remember Stanley did say that Ansom was bringing the Pliers to him...


    I would bet money that there is, in fact, one and only one person who is capable of attuning to a particular Arkentool in existence at a time. Specific, predestined individuals who must come together in fulfillment of prophecy seems consistent with Fate, at least as Wanda has presented it. Possibly even individuals who cannot be croaked until their purpose is fulfilled. Certainly, Stanley has survived due to more luck than one person should deserve.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:00 pm 
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    Ok, out of respect to some of the genuinely interesting theories I've seen posted here as a result of new information given on an update-to-update basis, I'll take my best shot at a tinfoil hat theory.

    Wanda DOES want to reach an "end game" type scenario and/or knows it's coming and is preparing, and is uniting all the arkentools for the purpose of well, "winning" this event, as suggested earlier. The Predictomancer that gave her her knowledge of fate currently resides in the Magic Kingdom and is primarily responsible for the creation of the Summon Ultimate Warlord spell, and is the attuned wielder (secretly?) of the fourth (or, if it's a REALLY good secret, 5th+) Arkentool, giving her undeniably accurate predicting power. (obviously within some kind of limit, I'm not a big enough gamer to try and theorize on said limit. Perhaps this is also how the questionably overpowered/350k cost scroll with mathamancy bonus 500k+ artifact, other wins excluded discrepancy? Such a scroll could maybe not be made by just anyone or in any small amount of time, and this has in actuality been in the planning for a freakin' long time, the schmucker cost was just to pay the other casters involved, and was the bare minimum to get the job done. Perhaps explaining the 150k cost to have this beast of a spell cast? Hush money for the caster?)

    Wanda does not actually care if she is serving Stanley by technicality, because by her reasoning all Tools serve Fate in the ultimate end game scenario. She does care that she listens to Parson at all times, having had him summoned specifically to lead the Tools to ultimate victory. Over whom or what, I got nothing. The Beatles? Or I suppose since Rock is holy, what's the opposite of rock, Beethoven? Maybe more along the lines of Pop? ALL OTHER GENRES OF MUSIC!?

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:02 pm 
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    The best Wanda and Jillian artwork yet! Keep up the great work, Xin!

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:08 pm 
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    dan2178 wrote:
    Thus, there is a sort of paradox in that GK losing is not very plausible but GK winning is also not very plausible due to plot.


    Silly boy. As Ansom said once long ago, there's always a 3rd option. Wich I really have no idea what it will be at this point. But it will be awesome.

    On the other hand, GK winning now doesn't exactly mean they auto-win. Perhaps it means that the other sides finally start geting serious about them.

    After all, from all we've seen untill now, the royals made the big big mistake of thinking that GK wasn't much of a threat. They still tought about backstabbing each other. They still seek to manipulate, lie and betrayal to try to squeeze self-profit.

    But Hamster, Stanley and the rest of the crew have showed them that they're not to be triffled with. They're not just some mindless horde of decrypted wich you can hold off at a chokepoint. They're not a bunch of aristrocats whose feelings you can manipulate. They' didn't come to play at wars. They came to win wars. And if you don't face them with all your power and wits, you're gonna be crushed whitout mercy.

    No sir, what we've seen untill now are but the initial skirmishes. Introduction is almost over. True war starts now.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:11 pm 
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    joosy wrote:


    Jillian will stay alove somehow. She still has too big a part to play unless she is decrypted but whats the fun in that for Wanda.



    I agree. It would be a bit of a surprise for Jillian to be croaked as a decrypted Jillian isn't that great of a character. After all, Jillian's whole personality revolves around an urge to be free and decryption would destroy that.

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     Post subject: Re: Book 2 – Page 19
     Post Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:18 pm 
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    I really enjoy the face expressions. You can see Wanda's regret, that she has to deny, Jillians excitement, Wanda's disgust with the idea of loving Stanley.

    I think Stanley would keep another arkentool for himdelf, if they found one without an attuned wielder, even if he himself can't attune. Wearing two highly divine artefacts is definitly a sign of titanic favour, and he has to re-establish his special position as choosen one of the titans.
    (Although it would be funny to see all GK units in a line and watch try to attune to the new arkentool)

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