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 Post Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 9:11 am 
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Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.

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     Post Posted: Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:51 pm 
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    I wonder if a Signamancer could link with another caster and make a Kindle type item. A book that could access every book ever published.

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     Post Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 10:49 am 
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    At Gencon, Taikei no Yuurei and I were discussing Charlie, and came up with the following idea:

    Ditto-Think-Carny: DDoS attack on Charlie. The Carny cheats the Dittomancer into infinitely duplicating the number of Thinkagrams sent to Charlie.

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    GJC wrote:
    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
    There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.

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     Post Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 12:48 pm 
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    0beron wrote:
    At Gencon, Taikei no Yuurei and I were discussing Charlie, and came up with the following idea:

    Ditto-Think-Carny: DDoS attack on Charlie. The Carny cheats the Dittomancer into infinitely duplicating the number of Thinkagrams sent to Charlie.

    Brilliant.
    So very-not-sure about letting Charlie know that such a thing is possible, though.

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     Post Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:16 pm 
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    would a look think dirt be able to see every gem in a hex? it would be great if Parson needed any cash. if look can be added to a link to do a spell remotely, then I want a look think turn to turn a high level warlord right in the middle of battle. turn think florist to create a poison that turns people or makes it easier to turn them. luck think turn to create a scroll that will instantly pop a single unit of caster's choice. Might be able to be done as an olive level peace spell by a turn. if so then a ditto could presumably duplicate it and create a second caster/ Warlord with max leadership and perfect stats and a good mind to top it off. If the spell isn't able to choose the mind of the unit, then a signamancer might be able to do it after the spell.

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     Post Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 7:10 pm 
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    conmor wrote:
    would a look think dirt be able to see every gem in a hex?

    A findamancer instead of a lookamancer would probably be more successful.

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     Post Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 9:51 am 
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    0beron wrote:
    At Gencon, Taikei no Yuurei and I were discussing Charlie, and came up with the following idea:

    Ditto-Think-Carny: DDoS attack on Charlie. The Carny cheats the Dittomancer into infinitely duplicating the number of Thinkagrams sent to Charlie.

    Very cool idea. You might be hard pressed to find a powerful enough Carny that isn't Charlie aligned though.

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     Post Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:08 pm 
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    wouldn't a findamancer find individual gems at a time? and a lookamancer looks and sees all of them? A find would be useful to see if there are gems in the hex though. Does every hex have gems in it?

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     Post Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:21 pm 
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    conmor wrote:
    wouldn't a findamancer find individual gems at a time? and a lookamancer looks and sees all of them? A find would be useful to see if there are gems in the hex though. Does every hex have gems in it?

    Heh, It's not like we ever seen findmancy in a good extent. Do remember that a thinkamancer does contribute its discipline to the link.

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     Post Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:33 am 
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    I was watching Reboot the other day, and I started thinking about the Game Cube that is used in that show. For anyone who is unfamiliar with Reboot, the Game Cube is a zone that comes in from the sky of the show's world and puts all those inside into a game that must be beaten in order to set things back to normal.

    I am thinking something like this could be done using a Foolamancer (to create the illusion of the game) and either a Weirdomancer to reduce move to zero until the game is over, or a Carny to break the rules on hex boundaries. Actually now that I think of it, you would want a Carny. They could also set the rules of the game to be played... In fact now that I REALLY think about it, you would want Weird/Carny, and just let the zone keep appearance. That would let you apply Flying specials or something to everyone in the hex.

    Practical application:
    Send your linkup to a hex your enemies will almost certainly cross (like your front gate) and set the trap. Have the trap triggered by something (not a number of units unless you know that), perhaps the first unit to leave the hex sets off the trap. BOOM! Stuck in a hex with rules (probably advertised somehow) that prevent any of your units from engaging units outside the hex (stops archers) until someone wins the game (which could be Last Man Standing or Don't Get Cut or Keep Both Your Arms or Don't Touch The Ground). Set the right rules and your opponents come out drastically weakened/kill themselves off and you know right where they will be when they get weak.

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     Post Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 2:53 am 
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    Hmm, not too up on everything all the caster types can do but there are several points i think that could be useful. First anything that extends the ability of one member of the link beyond the current hex if they normally can't work beyond their current hex would be downright dangerous just because of the flexibility it offers.

    he idea of combining dirtmancy with something else to produce buildings that produce stuff is nice, but it sounds a bit too easy and i think the catch is that we've never seen any dirtmancer actually produce a building that produces something. Sure they can upgrade a City, but they can't create out of whole cloth so to speak.

    That might be a bit different if your trying to work with two casters who can both effect something in different ways separately, (a flowermancer and a dirtmancer can both affect most plant bearing tiles so a farm from them would be reasonable), however that doesn't mean sufficient linking if we assume more than 3 way can be done somehow, (i actually think charlie's allready done it more in a bit), then i think it might be doable if you've got the right options on some other caster somewhere, dirt + carny + sign might be able to do it, Dirt to build, Sign to give purpose to what's built, and Carny to allow the thing built in contravention of the normal rules of cities only getting things via upgrades and normal limits of dirtmancy upgrades. You'd still need others to add on the unit's, but I've got a really evil one for you, dittomancer, copy any existing unique unit into a mass producible form, (if it's leveled with random chance of each of the original options, plus maybe extra options based on those in link at time if said individual is one of the linked people).

    Imagine copying a leveled royal heir. Random special, (including potentially leadership), from leveling and the royal type stat bonus's on a unit that's probably a fraction the price of a true heir.

    As far as multi-link up's go. Charlie display's a number of potent linking abilities, particularly his ability to break links without help. it took 5 thinkmancers to unravel maggie, wanda, and siedemore safely at the end of book 1. Yet Charlie does it so easily. Issac might be able to form and break links that easily, maybe even some of the other Great Minds. But as powerful as Charlie is i doubt he's that good. In fact do we even know if he has serious base level thinkamancy, or just the minimum to attune to an artifact. Either way i have to question weather Charlie is really responsible for the links he does at all, or if it's the dish. If the latter, (and i think it's a strong possibility), Kingsworld might have been the equivalent of a 4 way linkup with 3 non-thinkmancer casters linked by the dish.

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     Post Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 9:40 am 
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    Carl wrote:
    [Dirtmancers] can't create out of whole cloth so to speak.
    Sizemore is able to build structures in the MK, which isn't a city site.

    Carl wrote:
    a flowermancer and a dirtmancer can both affect most plant bearing tiles so a farm from them would be reasonable
    Not only reasonable, but actually confirmed by Word of the Titans.

    Carl wrote:
    it took 5 thinkmancers to unravel maggie, wanda, and sizemore safely at the end of book 1. Yet Charlie does it so easily.
    That's because of several reasons. They were ordered to do it, rather than being willing, and willingness is said to be a factor. Secondly, Wanda was already mentally damaged from the Suggestion backlash. Thirdly, they may have just wanted to play it safe, because the Great Minds are so invested in Parson's success,

    Carl wrote:
    Either way i have to question weather Charlie is really responsible for the links he does at all, or if it's the dish. If the latter, (and i think it's a strong possibility), Kingsworld might have been the equivalent of a 4 way linkup with 3 non-thinkmancer casters linked by the dish.
    I've suggested this before, that the 'Dish itself actually is a "caster" and is responsible for the links. So Charlie is essentially already in a bi-link 24/7. However, I don't see why you'd think Kingworld is a 4-link, who's the 4th? Vanna provides the Turn, the 'Dish provides the Think for the link, and Charlie provides the Carny.

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    GJC wrote:
    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
    There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.

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     Post Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:36 pm 
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    Sorry i think the part you first quoted confused you a bit let my try addressing thing, (I'm gonna use numbered points for each quote).

    1. What i mean is i don''t think a drtmancer can produce a building that produces something except as part of the normal city upgrade. They can produce buildings sure. But stuff that produces other stuff by itself. We've never seen that.

    2. I know about WoG, my point is that why i figure it works there. They can both effect a tile in different ways so they can achieve something neither alone quite could.

    3. I know there's some extra issues there, (though i'd note that wanda didn't seem to think the table linkup was dangerous without Parson's goof up so i doubt willingness would be anywhere near as problematic as your implying), but it still seems pretty hefty that it took 5 other thinkmancers to unravel the link. That's some serious juice and goes a bit beyond the pale here. Sure that's almost certainly not the norm, but it shows you don't need a parson style goof up to have issues, yet Charlie has built a reputation on never having any. That suggests that he's a lot more adept at breaking and forming links safely than he really ought to be IMO.

    4. I've just seen some speculation it would require more and i'm not convinced that kind of thing could be that easy. If it was, someone else would have figured it out ages ago, and it wouldn't have come as a total shock to everyone.

    Look at my carny-sign-dirt quad link. I think a carnny could make it possible to allow a building that creates units to be built as something other than a city upgrade, but i don't think they could allow a dirtmancer to turn something that looks like it can produce units into something that actually can, so you'd need another caster in the link to turn the shell into reality. A Signmancer seemed the best bet based on what i know.

    Same with Kingsworld. A Turnmancer can affect turn's, but some of her effects are friendly, some aren't. A carny could let her break her normal targeting restrictions. However would she by default have the ability to end a turn? I'd say no. You'd need someone else in the link to let her apply her abilities like that. Not sure what though. Of course it may just need a ruler, (someone who can normally end turns) in which case charlie has it covered.

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     Post Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:22 pm 
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    Carl wrote:
    3. I know there's some extra issues there, (though i'd note that wanda didn't seem to think the table linkup was dangerous without Parson's goof up so i doubt willingness would be anywhere near as problematic as your implying), but it still seems pretty hefty that it took 5 other thinkmancers to unravel the link. That's some serious juice and goes a bit beyond the pale here.
    To be fair, we don't know that the Eyemancers were linked against their will, it could have been something they were interested in. And moreover, when they broke, there WAS extensive damage, so clearly Wanda was wrong anyway or you misinterpretted her tone. As for the Volcano link, I think that the circumstances of it combined with the Great Minds being so heavily invested is enough to justify an overzealous response. Janis was only asking for 1. This doesn't tell us that 5 were actually needed, it just shows the level of commitment from the Great Minds.
    Carl wrote:
    Sure that's almost certainly not the norm, but it shows you don't need a parson style goof up to have issues, yet Charlie has built a reputation on never having any. That suggests that he's a lot more adept at breaking and forming links safely than he really ought to be IMO
    As for Charlie, I disagree that he's built a reputation on never having goofs, his ability to link AT ALL is a card he's held pretty close to his chest. He's only broke it out twice, in situations of dire personal importance, when he was able to get a CYA on it and have no knowledge shared or have plausible deniability. Aside from these 2 instances (about to become 3), he is only said to occasionally bring hired casters to the city physically for linking, so they're willing and ready. If anything, given how most casters seem to talk about links, they don't sound super dangerous and the Eyemancers/Volcano links were the exception rather than the norm.

    Carl wrote:
    4. I've just seen some speculation it would require more and i'm not convinced that kind of thing could be that easy. If it was, someone else would have figured it out ages ago, and it wouldn't have come as a total shock to everyone.
    I strongly disagree with this. The whole POINT of having Parson is that his lateral thinking is a novelty in Erfworld aside from Charlie. Nobody else thought of uncroaking a volcano, even when one of the casters who did it can use Dirtamancy herself, so she has the understanding! In order for someone else to yhave thought of Kingworld before, you'd need:
    • ~A side with a Turn, Think, and Carny
    • ~A situation in which that side is losing a fight but would somehow win if the attackers stopped being on-turn
    • ~Someone to put the first 2 facts together and come up with an idea to end the turn, in a very un-Erfworldly burst of lateral thinking.
    Doesn't sound so likely now, does it?

    Carl wrote:
    Same with Kingsworld. A Turnmancer can affect turns, but some of her effects are friendly, some aren't. A carny could let her break her normal targeting restrictions. However would she by default have the ability to end a turn? I'd say no. You'd need someone else in the link to let her apply her abilities like that. Not sure what though. Of course it may just need a ruler, (someone who can normally end turns) in which case charlie has it covered.
    Here you explain exactly how Kingworld can be done by only "3" individuals. Even your own explanation doesn't ellicit the need for a 4 caster type. I would further add that Carnymancy can break/create multiple rules at once, so even if manipulation of Turns isn't normally the purview of Turnamancy (yes, that sentence was worded exactly to point out how silly of an assumption that'd be) Charlie could have used magic to allow it. So I'm still not seeing why you think it had to be a 4-way...

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    GJC wrote:
    Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
    There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.

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