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 Post Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2017 4:54 pm 
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Burley wrote:
I totally get that, but since we haven't really moved into the more complicated stacks and modifiers, I don't want to have a public list of projects that might end up being a distraction from the current task, until playtesting has given us a solid and mostly-permanent groundwork to build up from.
Does that seem reasonable, or micro-managey? I can't tell.


Nah that seems reasonable, but we should probably have a plan somewhere of what order we'd like things established. There'll be parallel development of course, but it would give volunteers an idea as to where to focus their attention.

For example; I imagine priorities are things that are required to reach the play test stage, which would be;

*how to attack
*how to move
*determining turn order
*Basic units like infantry

Next category would probably be;

* map development
* intermediate units like knights and warlords
* Specials
* balancing sides

Last would be;

* advanced units like casters
* advanced rules like readied actions
* balancing units

Do we currently have anything like that?

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     Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 8:12 am 
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    Knavigator wrote:
    Nah that seems reasonable, but we should probably have a plan somewhere of what order we'd like things established. There'll be parallel development of course, but it would give volunteers an idea as to where to focus their attention.

    For example; I imagine priorities are things that are required to reach the play test stage, which would be;
    [snip]
    Do we currently have anything like that?



    I'm 100% confident that 0beron has all that in mind and we Core Advisers will certainly be in discussions with him about how to best plan and disseminate that information.

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     Post Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:17 am 
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    Burley wrote:
    Knavigator wrote:
    Nah that seems reasonable, but we should probably have a plan somewhere of what order we'd like things established. There'll be parallel development of course, but it would give volunteers an idea as to where to focus their attention.

    For example; I imagine priorities are things that are required to reach the play test stage, which would be;
    [snip]
    Do we currently have anything like that?



    I'm 100% confident that 0beron has all that in mind and we Core Advisers will certainly be in discussions with him about how to best plan and disseminate that information.


    If you think about it and look at the rule systems being offered so far on the wiki, we are more or less, in a probing phase for the first set of things you listed. Where we go from there is going to be determined somewhat by the results of the playtesting. But there is an overarching plan in mind.

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     Post Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:12 pm 
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    Part of Erfworld is that the rules are not clear to those who live in it. Everybody knows that having 10 combat is better then having 9 combat, but only a mathamancer could tell you how much better.

    With a public set of rules, it will both ruin that theme and downgrade mathamancers, and without a rule set the game can't be played. But I have a solution!
    The published rule set will be the one that was decided is best, with slight encouragement for GMs to use a slightly modified version, and with links to stored discussions about ideas/modifications that were abandoned.

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    Last edited by Hungirly awaits on Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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     Post Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 10:49 pm 
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    Hungirly awaits wrote:
    Part of Erfworld is that the rules are not clear to those who live in it. Everybody knows that having 10 combat is better then having 9 combat, but only a mathamancer could tell you how much better.


    I disagree with that. Non-casters have shown to be able to do some maths. Vinny in particular with the Siege assault, but also Trammanis when dealing with Charlie, and there's nothing stopping units memorizing probability tables from historical records.

    Mathamancy's power comes from more hidden relations. An experienced unit could tell you how often the 10 historically beats the 9 but a mathamancer can do something like this;

    Spoiler: show
    A level 3 city has 100 garrisoned troops according to scouts. You have a force of 300 2 turns away or 1 turn away if you travel through a lightning hex.

    The enemy has a force of 50 troops with a level 3 warlord within 1 turn and a contingent with caster 3 turns away, their destinations are unknown.

    What are the chances of;

    - taking the city if you go through the storm hex
    - taking the city if you go around the storm hex
    - holding the city in both scenarios
    - of getting away with more than x units if you raze
    - Intercepting and capturing the caster
    - Assaulting the warlords group then taking the city
    - etc...


    Balancing mathamancy for stack combat might take some thinking. They seem pretty cold casters but I'm sure all casters have some tricks that make them useful.

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     Post Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 12:07 pm 
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    Okay, I went too far with my example, but there is still an issue. Think about how your example will work out in practice: The GM itself is not a mathamancer, he'll either guesstimate from his understanding of the rules and his math skills (which might not be higher then those of all the participating players), or use some sort of software tool, which will likely also be available to the players. They can always agree to not do those calculations for RP reasons, but still players who are good at math will devalue mathamancers. My obscuration suggestion might be too much of a bother, so buffing mathamancers somehow is easier. I have some ideas for that but I don't want to distract from the stack combat focus.

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     Post Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 7:57 pm 
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    Hungirly awaits wrote:
    Okay, I went too far with my example, but there is still an issue. Think about how your example will work out in practice: The GM itself is not a mathamancer, he'll either guesstimate from his understanding of the rules and his math skills (which might not be higher then those of all the participating players), or use some sort of software tool, which will likely also be available to the players. They can always agree to not do those calculations for RP reasons, but still players who are good at math will devalue mathamancers. My obscuration suggestion might be too much of a bother, so buffing mathamancers somehow is easier. I have some ideas for that but I don't want to distract from the stack combat focus.


    Maybe I've misunderstood something at some point, but I thought that for the current target (stack battles) the goal is to not have a GM be necessary?

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     Post Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:31 am 
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    Point of order: if you have an idea that might be useful later on, but which isn't directly related to the top priorities, put it in Odds and Ends on the wiki. Magic is fun to talk about, but it's low priority.

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     Post Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:57 am 
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    Knavigator wrote:
    Maybe I've misunderstood something at some point, but I thought that for the current target (stack battles) the goal is to not have a GM be necessary?


    Then I guess I'm thinking about farther away in the future then is discussed.

    Twofer wrote:
    Point of order: if you have an idea that might be useful later on, but which isn't directly related to the top priorities, put it in Odds and Ends on the wiki. Magic is fun to talk about, but it's low priority.


    With mathamancers it's not cohesive enough for it to be added now, but I'll remember this page in the future.

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     Post Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 10:12 am 
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    A Mathamancer's worth to a player will be dependent on what they do. I don't forsee: generating statistics and probability pages to be of much worth to a player in a war game. So we'll have to make them do something that is worthwhile.

    As Twofer mentioned, if you have ideas head to the Odds and Ends page on the wiki and put it up there. Suggestions are always welcome.

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     Post Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:43 am 
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    houstinhobby wrote:
    A Mathamancer's worth to a player will be dependent on what they do. I don't forsee: generating statistics and probability pages to be of much worth to a player in a war game. So we'll have to make them do something that is worthwhile.

    As Twofer mentioned, if you have ideas head to the Odds and Ends page on the wiki and put it up there. Suggestions are always welcome.


    I'm sure some solution would be found. Anyways, I haven't forgotton about the Odds and Ends page, I'm just thinking I might use some of my caster theories to run a forum game in the future, and it doesn't seem like the subject will be dealt with until 2018 anyways, so I'll put nothing there for now. Anyways I don't have much to write there.

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     Post Posted: Sat Jun 03, 2017 10:23 pm 
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    We're planning on testing the basic combat mechanics soon with two unled stacks, details of the testing can be found on the rpg wiki. We have multiple systems to choose between and results of this testing will determine the foundations of the combat. If you're interested in helping with this, please send me a private message.

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     Post Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:07 am 
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    do we still have to pm you if we're already registered on the volunteers page?

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     Post Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:45 pm 
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    Finn MacCool wrote:
    do we still have to pm you if we're already registered on the volunteers page?


    Those on the test team already need not. I'll be contacting those volunteers shortly.

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     Post Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:54 pm 
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    The following people are listed as testers, but the spelling of their usernames on the wiki does not correspond to their forum users. Attempts to PM them failed.

    Slasherpoch
    Cypermance
    The Krayzor

    If one of these is you, please PM me.

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     Post Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 1:02 pm 
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    Okay, I have not done much of anything for this in a few months, and that's my failing, sorry. I just looked over

    https://rpg.erfworld.com/Stack_Mechanic_Extractions

    And I realized that when I said "random generation" of combat pairings, when I was writing down my rules, I put no thought into how that would happen. What ended up being put down is not how I imagined it though.

    Anyway, I put an alternative suggestion in the discussion page, if it's still possible to modify it a bit.

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     Post Posted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 5:40 am 
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    tomaO2 wrote:

    And I realized that when I said "random generation" of combat pairings, when I was writing down my rules, I put no thought into how that would happen. What ended up being put down is not how I imagined it though.


    Thanks for catching that. Fortunately, it's not too important to the first test round given that it's uniform stacks.

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     Post Posted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 12:23 am 
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    I've been feeling inspired of late. So, welcome to my newest page.

    https://rpg.erfworld.com/Toma%27s_Unit_Creation

    This is my method for the creation of a Side's unique units. Since sides seem to have variable numbers of what units can be created, I decided not to focus on a method that allows variation in the number, and power level, of units, while still being somewhat equivalent. I do that with the concept of city levels. We all know that stronger units need a higher leveled city to be produced, so I just took that to the next step. By making it so that you have 6 city levels worth of unique units, you can create six twoll level units, two dwagon level types, or anything inbetween.

    For the creation of the actual units. My idea is to have various templates that can be modified. Basically, I give you a starter setup, and then you pick and choose what you want, and modify various aspects to suit your creativity. I set up an example that creates a twoll unit, that is based on Bogroll. I also worked out how to create stabbers and knights from the same system.

    Stabbers are a bit of an issue, as they don't quite fit with how I imagined them, but it's mostly okay. My biggest issue was trying to reconcile the fact that my rules, so far, state that stabbers can't hold both a sword and shield simultaneously, while knights and warlords can. This isn't an issue for pikers and bowmen, because they use two handed weapons, but stabbers use one handed weapons.

    Right now, I made it so that the reason why stabbers can't is because it's part of stabber weakening in order to increase production time, but I'm seriously thinking that this is just a needless complication.

    Alternatively, I could just let stabbers hold shields and swords, and just say that they don't pop with shields to save upkeep (I haven't determined how upkeep works yet). I like this idea, and canon doesn't say that it's impossible for stabbers to do this, but I've seen a few infantry units, and, whenever they hold a shield, they don't use a weapon.

    Anyway, the rule set is mainly focused on the creation of land units that are created in level 1 cities. Give it a look, and maybe try making your own unit, if you are so inclined, and tell me how well the process works for you.

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     Post Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:24 am 
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    Nice. :D

    I've put some comments on it, but not having any major issues with it.

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